SpaceTimeNow

That sounds frigging awesome, a shame that never happened.

But if they ate the mouse they need to carry the remains around until they can proudly drop them on the carpet in the captains office.

Maybe this is a more subjective impression then i thought. I allways looked at it from the perspective that taser and batons apply pain and agony to a character and are rather a tool of last resort whereas flashes are not that intrusive. The mental image of shocking someone with a stun baton until he drops on the floor screaming in pain just because he jumped the bar counter several times and refuses handcuffs just seems worng to me. Obviously game mechanic wise there is not much of a difference and i would also tase them when they just run and gain distance. For me a flash is more of a RP tool to get a point accross like someone fucking up in the bar and taser and baton are to get up into get up in someone's grill. Whatever the case i am over it and don't hold any grudges.

I have played a few rounds as HoP and the captain never made it on the station so a snatched his double emergency tank and filled it with nitrogen which is perfect for vox. Usually when i get bored or have some spare time i try to convince atmos techs to make me two emergency tanks with nitrogen, which basicly does the same but is more availiable. Except for the fact that when you go unconcious nobody could get you back on internals so i usually kept the big tank in my backpack as backup. I think it would be generally a good idea (for all races) that you should be able to mount every gas tank on the back slot (even the small blue ones). It does not make much sense that you need a gigantic gas tank to set someone on internals who is unconcious. I would have no problem with adding some resprited double emergency tank for vox if they could also, in case of emergency, be back mounted and used to put me back on internals. I think it should start with the same amount of gas as a vox starts currently with the big tank, whatever that translates too, i assume a double tank has less max capacity as a big tank. And having the ability to spawn vox with a backpack would certainly prevent a lot of extra coding work that would have to be done solely to make new changes work for vox. So yeah, if the coders don't want to address all the little issues that vox currently have (which i can totally understand) then just removing the big tank requirement would be one way to go. Edit: Well, i got interuppted writing this and didn't notice your response before sending mine. I will await the change:)

I have never thought about this as a threat, to me this came accross rather insulting to be honest. Especially when you are talking about a RP games meta gaming has allways negative connotation attached. And the last sentence where he basicly told me to play shitcurity was the real kicker. I think if there is one thing this forum could aggree on, than it's the fact that an officer that just takes a baton and a taser is straight up shitcurity. I am actually kinda stunned how you could consider this as a valid suggestion. But i would rather get over this and back to topic: That fact that i have to evaluate my equipment choises more than the regular security officer comes with the extrem storage limitations of the Vox race since this last changes. I generally enjoy this, because i think it's fun to have certain limitations and make the best of it, but in this case it just goes to far. Same would happen if the Engineering webbing would go poof. As a vox you just have your belt slot as storage and both Security and Engineering requires you to fill it up with job specific gear, leaving you with no space left for anything else. In most of the other jobs, like medbay, science, or the service departments you can usually slip by, by using your plastic bag. Especially in medical this bag is super handy. Also i wish it wasn't just a crappy plastic bag, i have never seen a doctor with a plastic bag attached to his belt. But on the other hand i have never seen a human sized bird in a hostpital either.

Could you please explain how picking up security equipment as a security officer is considered Meta gaming? You guys patched this stuff in the game and now i am beeing accused of meta gaming for pointing out your obvious failures that could have been prevented in the first place, if you would have applied some common sense. Way to Go.

I hear this annoying counter arguement about the lore every time i discuss anything about vox. 1. The vox lore is about 5 or 6 printed pages long 2. Many of it contains fluff or talks about a other vox species and don't aplly to the vox you encounter on the station. 3. It was obviously written cynically about the "bad" Vox Raiders 4. How can you take something so serious that contains sentences like: "Vox are found of darkness and hiding in lockers." Obviously Vox on an NT Station behave differently as a usual Vox, or they wouldn't be "alone" on the station anyways. It really is not that difficult to immagine that they would stand up for themselfs and do their job in security. Also security usually does not kill anyone except when thier lifes are threatened and vox have a strong desire to not leave anyone behind, which could also mean that they would stand up for their crew if someone tries to harm or kill them. And above all: Fuck lore, if it hinders gameplay or prevents good and useful changes to be made to the codebase! /rant over Please don't take this personal, it's more of a broader statement to vent my frustration.

I don't think anyone gave much thought about this at all, that's what this topic is about. My strong opinion on this matter is that player should not be penalized by the choice of their race to the extent that other races can revive back into the game and your race can not. I do aggree that diversity is fun, like having to wear a gigantic tank on the back, but in return you are able to EVA. But there is nothing that could balance out the fact that certain races are unable to revive and be extention are not able to play the game. At least that is my opinon. Up until now i have heard basicly two arguments against it: 1. Cloning Vox does not fit into the lore: I would argue that Vox lore is very dodgy about this matter and that there are many other changes made, like vox suddenly having blood that aren't exactly lore either. So i don't see why it's such a big deal now, especially if you consider that cloning vox was a thing for a long time. It would be totally reasonable that NT studied the vox that worked with them and implemented new technology to the cloning machines to do so. Lore is built around a game to make it richer and explain certain abilities or disabilities or events but when lore conflicts with a certain features that you want to implement, then you better change the lore and not the game. 2. The current code wouldn't allow it (Like inaprovaline killing the vox): For me this is no argument at all, considering i am writing this in a subforum which main purpose is to discuss changes to the existing code. Following this reasoning their are only two ways to deal with it: - Implement a quick & dirt solution that may not fare well with the lore. (Clone vox and slimes) or - Take the time and develop a better solution that would allow for revival in a way that would harmonize with the current lore. I am leaving IPC out of this discussion because they can be revived at the moment, it's just buggy as hell and that's a topic for the Bug Report forum.

Well this is kind of a moot point, they have been put in the game a long time ago and when changes are made, they should be resonable for all.

God, i feel like the vox ambassador for this forum I recently played vox in security and noticed how much of an impact the recent security gear changes have on Vox security officers. The lack of the webbing and the smaller security belt results in 7 slots less (i think). Before the change i would usually gear up like this: Security belt: Security tape 2 handcuffs Flashbang pepperspray taser baton Webbing: 2 evidence bags 2 donuts one free storage slot Pockets: 1 flash one free storage slot Leaving me with reduced but decent security gear and two free storage slots. One for longer term storage in the webbing and one for immediate access in my pocket. If i really needed the space i could just nom the two donuts and have two more. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- With the changes i have to gear up something like this: Security belt: Security tape Nope 2 handcuffs Nope Flashbang pepperspray taser baton +Seclite Webbing: Nope 2 evidence bags Nope 2 donuts Nope one free storage slot Nope Pockets: 1 flash one free storage slot Nope + 1 handcuff This is absolutely bare bones security gear and i still don't have any free storage slots. HELP ME!

I would generally like to see a change to this gigantic lists. - camara list (possible groups: Medbay, Brig, Engineering...) - PDA messanger (possible groups: Security, Medical Staff, Command, ....) - protolathe contstruction list (Not sure about the groups, don't play it that much) - probably many more They are all a pain to navigate and allways reset to the top of list when you clicked something. There should be some kind of grouping applied, so you could first pick a group and then the item you want to select and after that the list should stay at the same position. If i want to look into another group i collapse the current one and open another. That would be awesome.

I don't think respawn is allowed on Paradise. Even if, i would prefer to continue my character and not play a new one and force yourself not to meta game anything. Obviously there are other ways to "get back into the game", but like i explained at the beginning of the posts this options are either to rare (because they are admin or event dependent) or they are just a very very weak substitute of a real character. Same works for Vox. But it's even more infuriating as having to watch the round as a ghost: - it takes a metric fuck ton of time for the right doctor to find you and then for him having time and the will to make a monkey human, transplant and clone. - because it takes so long, the doctor half asses the monkey clone and you get a body with the wrong gender, random skin color, blue hair and a green beard. If you are very lucky they remove the braindamage and close up your skull. - So you wake up in a body you don't want to play and by that time all your stuff has been looted clean. So you have no gear, no id, nobody believes you who you are. Fun times. I would not call this back in the game. Been there two times and it sucked.

I still don't see how people could aggree that's a bad thing for player to get back into the round, regardless of race. This weekend i died 3 times very early to some random crap, allways at the time of day where very few players are online and rounds keep going forever. I thought i could have some fun RP but no, i just had to watch everyone else play for hours or do other stuff, while my bodies kept lying right next to the cloning machine. That time probably adds up to like 3-4 hours (in three rounds)! Does that mean i should not play Vox depending of the time of the day? I fail to see how there even needs to be a discussion about this matter. It's just bad game design to kick people out of the round depending of the race they choose. Either let everybody or nobody revive. I do aggree that maybe lore wise cloning a Vox might not be perfect, but it could work as a placeholder until there is a better game mechanic. Same goes for Slimes btw.

I also figured out that spawning as a diona is worse then expected. Got picked up by a random dina and merged with it (without giving me any choice and it's intant), great. Can't do shit at all except for talking and he seems afk for quite a while. So i guess i force ghost and the round is over for good. Honestly that's no fun, considering how long the rounds go at this time of the day.

Like i said, a body can be ejected early from cloning with a medical ID, obviously it comes out in a way more damged state but you can survive it with cryo and other meds. Not saying that's the best way to clone someone, but it's definitely better than no cloning at all. Not sure if the damge of inaprovaline is new on vox but it should be 0,4 tox damage, not sure how this would influence vox cloning, but obviously it could be coded to work. I just don't see the point of letting certain races not clone and get back into the game.

Since i can't play for the next like one or two hours, even though my body is right next to the cloning machine, i have plenty of time to warm up this topic.

Seems reasonable to me to have a Emergency ID in this cases. It beeing on a different ID gives you some sort of self control and others a good indication when you might step out of line.

So you finally joined the dark side? I kinda like the Vox names and they are iconic for me. I would be happy if your vox name would carry from round to round, but i don't want to see Herbert the vox running around.

That's the thing tought, he is not supposed to oversee anything other than the service departments (bar, kitchen, janitor ..) and the cargo area where he has the Quatermaster to do most of this work. I believe he were also responsible to collect performance reviews of other departments, but this never happend and now there is an NT Rep to do just that. It is true that his responsibilities and authority greatly expands when he is acting captain and of course then it's ok for him to have Captain-ish access. But until then he has technically zero authority over Science, Medbay, Security and Engineering. Of course his word is worth more to a engineer as the word of an civilian, because who want's to anger an Head of Staff, but the Engineer would have the right to ignore orders from the HoP.

You were mentioning that creating all access IDs is ok, because there are only few players (antags & griefers) that would abuse it, assuming the others are not allowed by the server rules. This is clearly out of game knowledge. This is both an IC and OOC concern. Everyone should have sufficient access with his default IDs to do his job. There should be a good reason to give addional access and there are people that should be notified and have to aggree when handing out additional access. Hence the paperwork and signatures of Heads of Staff. Also if a HoP creates himself (or the blueshield) an all access ID, then their is basicly a thrid captain ID on the station, which is a major security concern in itself. This could be both, the definition of your character or an excuse for defaulting to giving yourself an all access ID. It's not my intention to judge you and i am willing to believe that you don't missuse this access for more than aquireing shinys, but their are others that do abuse it and don't think the general idea of HoPs giving themself all access is a good thing. Edit: Also i would like to get back on topic. Is the the HoP is supposed to be able to enter the basic areas of engineering (the foyer, the equipment room and the small hallway in front of the CEs office)

[spoiler2][/spoiler2] What station is this map from? I really like the details and stuff in maintenance.

I aggree it would realistically make sense, but i don't see how this would transition well into SS13. Using hearing protection would mean that you couldn't hear anyone around you talking. So you have the choice between beeing deaf while the big fire fight (hearing protection) or after it. I think this would impact RP way to much. The only benefit i would see is that if a random derp steals a weapon he would have problems when using it. But i don't think that's worth it.

Didn't knew that one. Seems also to work the light bulbs. Also found out you can rig a crate with cables and a electropack.

Fair point, i am just wondering why a HoP has basic acces to Security, Medbay, Science but can't make a single step into Engineering. Maybe the Engineering foyer, the gear room and the small hallway in front of the CEs office should just require engineering access to enter? So you could reach the CE office. Issn't it like that in every other department? Medbay access let's you inside the Mebay, not the specific rooms. What other people do to game the system doesn't really interests me (that's for the admins to decide), i will play the HoP as he is supposed to be played. With or without Engineering access. This is meta gaming. Probably a violation of the rules, i would be careful with this. With this mindset you could just hand out all access IDs at the round start. Because hey, i give like 40 non antags all access but only like 5 antags. Most of the player just don't have enough self-restraint to use additional access reasonably, if i give a security officer all access to medbay, you can be damn sure he will go in there and try to play doctor whenever it fits him. He will get in the way of actual doctors and meta game the shit out of everything and perform brain surgery as a security guard. On his way out he will raid the chemistry and make himself some oxycodone because he has access, right? It's not only his privilege to go inside, IT'S HIS FRIGGING DUTY! If a HoP drags someone into cloning (which he should have no access to) and starts cloning him (which he should not know how to do) while i am playing a doctor just waiting for some work, i get this gigantic urge to buy the HoP a one way ticket down disposals, back to his department and area of expertise.

Just to clarify i am not actually a coder for the server, someone else will have to do it:)