Shadeykins

There was a time where geneticists didn't have limits on how many powers they could have and where hulk was permanent until death. This period of time is all the evidence you need for why genetics does not need any buffs whatsoever.

@Saul Argon @Dinarzad No, bringing plasteel for engineers to pick up irrespective of whether or not you're giving it to them is pretty direct. I'm not misconstruing anything, I just don't make a fine distinction between these two actions. Whether or not you leave something for someone or hand it directly to them is irrelevant, you get the same result and you're still interacting with them (transactionally, to be specific). You shouldn't be bringing anything anywhere for anyone unless it's another maint drone, fullstop - I even went as far as to ask around about this to make sure I'm not being obtuse - literally the first response I got every time was "Isn't that violating the maint drone laws?" This isn't even to get into the fact that maintdrones are not intended to be replacements for engineering borgs. For repeated suggestions on removing maintdrones, go to the GitHub. Hit "Pull Requests" remove "is:open" type "maint", look for the maint drone PR's. Read the comments, there is in fact a maint drone PR right now balancing emagged drones with comments suggesting they should be outright removed. There was also calls to remove them outright in lieu of reverting when the maintdrones got replaced with /tg/ gerbil ball monstrosities. As for your 'mental state', you're all-capsing words and using a profuse amount of profanity. I'm pretty sure I'm allowed to make a judgement about your mood (inordinately angry) based off you saying "fucking" 200 times when replying to me.

I'm 100% on this. I've never approved of vine/glowshroom nonsense.

An interesting idea, but I think you'd need to be very careful about what kind of chems it has and how many units. 300 Water, 300 Potassium for instance is about 15-20 charge and creates an explosion the size of a maxcap.

1) ? What. The nature of the server is people come and go. I've been around for 2 years and even I vanish for 4-6 months now and then. That's not a personal attack. I even went as far as to say you seem to have a different idea of playing Rep, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. The fact that you think I'm personally attacking you is ridiculous, as I have it on good authority that you're one of the better reps and couched my entire post from that angle. Me saying "Why yes, you can handle multiple cases at a time" and then elaborating "But most people can't, so we shouldn't base this around your personal capabilities" is not a personal attack, it's stating that you're a cut above the rest and because of that we should realistically situate ourselves *below* your capabilities. I suggest you read the entirety of my post because you've somehow mistaken a compliment for an insult. 2) The idea pushed forward (which has been floating for some time) is the NT Rep is the IAA's boss. I don't mind the NT Rep working with IAA's, but he shouldn't be their co-departmental head which is what is being pushed forward. People want the NT Rep to have direct control over the IAA's and direct them around/tell them what to do. 3) This is about changes to NT Rep SoP which I've put forward in writing in an earlier post. It's very pertinent and it has everything to do with the topic on hand.

Arguing that what you're doing is irrelevant to the drone being emagged is silly, because it has direct impact on what emagged drones can do. That's like saying giving borgs hands has no impact on a borgs effectiveness as a traitor. Things do not exist in a vacuum. I'm not sure why you're so ludicrously upset at me pointing out it provides undue power to drones, which are contentious to have around in the first place. Bringing materials to engineers is pretty direct involvement, this isn't even tangential involvement - it's a literal transaction where you are supplying engineering with materials. Me saying drones shouldn't be bringing engineers materials != Drones can't do anything whatsoever. Drones have free reign to repair, maintain, and improve the station so long as they're not involving other beings in their actions. A drone fixing a breach is fine. A drone playing fetch and dragging plasteel from space to an unhardsuited engineer probably isn't. This isn't rules lawyering, it's pretty damn clear from how the law is worded - one directly involves you with crew and the other doesn't. I also don't know why you're going off on a tangent about FUN!!!. Me vehemently disagreeing with your suggestions/pointing out issues that I personally find is not some part of an overarching conspiracy where a cabal of people are polluting Paradise with a toxic mindset so we can "go an a rampage". Drones/borgs were never meant to have the power/capabilities of full crew members and it's a route we should never go down. Honestly drones shouldn't be able to drag anything at all, because the vast majority of the time it's not used for anything good (they can drag things like banana peels, for reference).

That's not an attack on you. You were positing that something should be changed based off the fact that's the way you play the job. Your entire argument is predicated based off the fact that you want to manage the IAA's and that you're capable of doing so. I'm aware you're capable of doing so - but most people who play Rep aren't and don't choose the role to run a department. The basis of your argument was based off your personal experience with the position and doesn't take broader considerations into account, pointing out the flaws in that form of argumentation is not a personal attack on you in any way, shape, or form. Opinions can be wrong, me challenging your opinion does not equate to me personally attacking you. As stated earlier your idea fails to take into account the knock-on effects, complications, and power-creep your suggestion entails.

Drones are exclusively a job meant to occupy ghosts who don't intend to respawn, and there has been multiple calls on the Git to remove them (if you pay attention to the discussions there). People get pissy at drones because they go around unwelding vents, or cleaning messes during cult rounds with blood goals. I assumed by dragging you meant pick up - if you just mean dragging it's still no. Nobody needs emagged drones stealing materials from EVA and such for the purposes of being a dick. My point is you shouldn't be dragging materials for engineers or working in concert with them, you're supposed to be pretty much oblivious and not give a fuck about anything the crew is doing/anything that impacts the crew as a maint drone. You're just supposed to repair things. Leaving materials for engineers is pretty directly involving yourself with non-drones.

I've gone 3 months without antag before, and I've gotten Antag every round for like two weeks (generally I ahelp to give my antag to someone else if I'm getting it too much). It's absolutely fair, even if it doesn't seem "equitable". The fact that there's a rule about antag fishing should tell you how fair this is, when people who normally get antag are early-logging because they didn't get it.

You should never be actively helping anyone as a drone, or doing thoughtful things like "moving materials for engineers" unless you're emagged. This is in direct opposition to your lawset as a drone, and is all the more reason why you shouldn't have the capability to drag such things around. 1. You may not involve yourself in the matters of another being, unless the other being is another drone. 2. You may not harm any being, regardless of intent or circumstance. 3. You must maintain, repair, improve, and power the station to the best of your abilities. Removing the drone console is already bannable (I have seen people job-banned from maint-drone over this in the past). This isn't even to bring up the HUGE pain in the ass emagged maint drones with plasteel would be.

You could, but we shouldn't make design decisions based off of one player who may not be around for a long time. Alternatively as someone who has played Rep quite a few times, I can say that's a it's a relatively easy job with little overhead even when you have terrible people in Command. People who play NT Rep aren't supposed to be managers, and this just makes NT Rep more of a headache than it's supposed to be since now you're responsible for running a department (which will include hiring, firing, approving transfers, etc). Not to mention the conundrum this creates when someone tries to fire an IAA who was approved by the NT Rep to transfer in. As for cases, if you're juggling 3-4 cases something is seriously wrong there. You needn't juggle any amount of cases - find out what's going on (which is dirt simple), advise people on what they should be doing and if they don't write a quick fax and shoot it off to Central. This takes ten minutes, tops. It sounds like you have a very different idea of how to go about playing an NT Rep, which may not necessarily be a bad thing. I've personally always looked at it for the 2+ years I've had it unlocked as an advisory role, meant to advise and mitigate issues that crop up. This doesn't require a full-fledged investigation because the underlying factors are almost always readily apparent. The CMO, RD, CE, etcetera are not supposed to be MD+, Scientist+, or Engineer+. They are supposed to manage their departments but are most often these things because most of the departments are filled with inept people - none of these jobs actually has to lift a finger to do anything (and be full and well within their responsibilities both in SoP and otherwise) so long as they adequately direct their departments. This isn't to get into the fact that they're not karma positions, and you're advocating locking a departmental head behind a karma gate. In SoP, the only thing the CMO is obligated to do is make sure bodies are being cloned and chemistry isn't making explosives. Realistically, all the have to do is make sure doctors are healing people. In practice, this is pretty accurate. About 50% of the successful CMO's aren't actively healing patients. In SoP, the only thing the RD is obligated to do is make sure borgs are slaved to the AI and that someone is doing research. Realistically, all they have to do is... Pretty much nothing. Nobody cares about the RD, this is honestly a job that could be removed. In practice, 99% of RD's do absolutely nothing and nobody notices. In SoP, the only thing the CE is obligated to do is make sure Atmos/the Engine don't get sabotaged. Realistically, all they have to do is set up the engine (if other engineers haven't) and tells engineers where to go. In practice, this is exactly what happens and nobody bats an eye. The engine gets set up, and the CE and Engineers do whatever they feel like. Also you'll note that in my proposition I outright have a clausal section that states "if no IAA's are present". Command level issues and crew level issues still have no overlap. If the Coroner and Chemist are having a pissing match, that's the CMO's problem. If the CMO can't deal with it, they elevate to the Captain. The Captain involves the NT Rep, or the NT Rep involves himself when the Captain can't deal with it. There are a lot of layers to this before an NT Rep should ever, ever inject themselves into a situation. The Coroner and Chemist not getting along with each other is not your concern, The CMO being mildly inadequate and not resolving this situation isn't even your concern (though you should advise the Captain about it). The Captain not doing anything about it is immediately your concern. The CMO violating protocol and not cloning bodies is immediately your concern. What individual members of departments are doing however, is not. This is all the NT Rep should be concerning himself/herself with. https://nanotrasen.se/wiki/index.php/Standard_Operating_Procedure_(Command) https://nanotrasen.se/wiki/index.php/Chain_of_Command https://nanotrasen.se/wiki/index.php/Legal_Standard_Operating_Procedure#Brigging I think most of you need to legitimately take a step back and think about the implications of what an NT Rep who is hovering over the entirety of the crew is doing. They've got their fingers in way too many damn pies, and it comes off as power tripping (which an NT Rep should certainly not be doing). Not only that but they're going to be blind to any actual issues in Command when they're busy sitting in their office (which too many reps do already) listening to a low-level complaint about how "george melons griffed me!" (because let's be honest, that's 100% of the low-level SoP violations). You're deliberately being subordinate by not allowing things to be solved at a *LOCAL* level, which is the primary objective of the NT Rep. Even incredible IAA's give their reports to the head of that department to resolve, they don't go in and try to throw their non-existent weight around.

No. That's not how antag tokens work. Antag tokens are only ever awarded if an admin screws your traitor round. They are exceedingly rare and are handed out almost never. The one time I've seen antag tokens handed out was because Regens crashed the server 20 minutes in by loading his ban list. You see a lot of the same people roll antag because, unsurprisingly since it's the default settings (unless this changed), most new players don't have antags enabled.

No, it isn't. This is the same damn thing as the Captain not being allowed to micromanage departments and there being a barrier/separation between the Captain and the regular crew. The NT Rep isn't on the station to deal with the chemist's pissing match with the Coroner, that's what IAA's are for. Honestly if the NT Rep is caught up in stupid little complaints instead of making sure Command is following SoP, they should probably be bwoinked for taking a job and then faffing around and not doing it. By not making this important distinction you give the NT Rep carte blanche over the entirety of the station, a person who can't be fired without admin assistance to boot. This isn't even to get into the absolute nonsense that is karma-gating someone who runs a department or having "joint departments". You do realize the NT Rep is subordinate to the HoP, yes? And by allowing the NT Rep control over the IAA's you by extension grant the HoP de facto control over them as well? This isn't even to get into the fact that IAA's will suddenly be able to tell both the HoS, Magistrate, and NT Rep to fuck themselves because they've got three bosses - none of which are ever going to all agree together to do something about a problem IAA. And no, Magistrate does not set a good precedent for "karma-gating" departmental heads. It leads to entitled behaviour where people think they're the ultimate boss and have been granted gods power to shout down from the heavens at the peons. Probably 50-60% of magistrates I've ever seen have job bans. There are damn good reasons why NT Rep's don't have control over IAA's.

That's a good thing. More confusion.

@tzo Genetics is completely unessential for science, yet has mechanics that are absolutely required for medical procedures that *need* to happen in a lot of instances. This isn't even to mention science creep. Genetics should be a part of medical if anything, because it contributes nothing necessary to science but it has things that are absolutely necessary for medical (Clean SE's, and humanized monkeys).

Next to, IIRC. The encryption keys are literally the worst.

Not a fan of tiered SoP, as it makes it needlessly complex. When we first introduced SoP we made most jobs have a standard SoP across all code levels to reduce confusion - making it more complicated will make it ignored even more and harder to enforce. As always, I am HIGHLY against the NT Rep having control/authority over Internal Affairs Agents; the scope of what the NT Rep is doing and the scope of what the IAA's are doing have little crossover, the NT Rep is only to be focused on command level issues and the IAA's only to be focused on crew level issues, unless no Command member is present. If you are an NT Rep and you are performing an IAA's job, you are not doing your own and this is no different than an MD deciding they're now the brig physician - they even have completely different roles in trials, with the NT Rep mediating for the defense and the IAA being prosecution. The NT Rep having say over the IAA's is just going to lead to collusion in the already difficult trials, and either the IAA's or the NT Rep won't be able to represent someone in a trial (when they're both supposed to be doing so). If anything SoP should make this distinction far clearer, as the general consensus by the seniors I spoke to when updating the NT Rep guide is that they really shouldn't be dealing with the chef not producing food or the bartender hosting a fight club. 1. The NanoTrasen Representative is to ensure that Departmental Heads of Staff abide by Standard Operating Procedure. The NanoTrasen Representative is not to concern themselves with Standard Operating Procedure violations committed by non-Command personnel, unless no Internal Affairs Agent is available. If a Head of Staff is not available for a Department, the NanoTrasen Representative must ensure that the Captain appoints an Acting Head of Staff for said Department; 2. The NanoTrasen Representative must attempt to resolve any breach of Standard Operating Procedure locally before contacting Central Command. This is an imperative: Standard Operating Procedure should always be followed unless there is a very good reason not to; 3. The NanoTrasen Representative must, together with the Magistrate and Head of Security, ensure that Space Law is being followed and correctly applied; 4. The NanoTrasen Representative must not, under any circumstances, attempt to interfere or intervene in an ongoing investigation being conducted by an Internal Affairs Agent. Furthermore, the NanoTrasen Representative is not permitted to give orders to Internal Affairs Agents, as they are under the purview of the Magistrate; 5. The NanoTrasen Representative may not threaten the use of a fax in order to gain leverage over any personnel, up to and including Command. In addition they may not threaten to fire, or have Central Command, fire anyone, unless they actually possess a demotion note; 6. The NanoTrasen Representative is permitted to carry their cane, or a Telescopic Baton if the cane is lost I'm 100% in agreement with the syringe gun and OR room tools SoP suggested above.

No, this was not removed in lockstep with the ability to change job slots. This is something that was changed awhile back. Security used to spawn with their SecHUDs, and I believe it was changed so the security equipment area was less of a candy shop for people who broke in given that sunglasseshuds are a fairly powerful piece of equipment. There's also something called Cargo to order in more equipment. It does not require two members of command and the entire cargo department working in tandem to get this done - it requires one person to stamp a form and order it; or even better, the Captain to click two buttons on a bridge console and tell a sec officer to go pick it up.

I understand where these laws are coming from (because they're an attempt to mirror real life ethics), but people need to realize these things aren't even upheld in real life. If police accidentally catch a guy with 20kg of cocaine and the search/seizure wasn't justified, he still goes to jail 100% of the time. Yes, you can look this up because this is exactly what happens - laws enacted to keep law enforcement from unreasonable search/seizure are trampled on all the time when they're impeding cases that obviously demand sentencing. In short all this will do is create admin overhead over a non-issue. Once again, it's in the rules that Security is beholden to their departmental SoP and breaching it can result in job bans. People do not need to be job banned over checking a headset that they can CLEARLY hear intercepting traffic or taking extra time when they've got an EoC. No-slips aren't even briggable contraband for reference, so this thread is a bit fallacious to begin with.

Completely irrelevant because borgs are terribly kneecapped and can't do even 50% of what a regular security officer can do. Here's some of the big ones for security in particular. 1) Borgs can't search people. 2) Borgs can't process people. 3) Borgs have no aux equipment to deal with large crowds (flashbangs, teargas, etc). 4) Borgs can't easily employ lethals from range.

Should probably remain offline.

Seems like it would create more problems than it solve, considering breaching SoP as security can net you job bans.

Thanks for bringing this up, Plasmaman has been needing some touching for awhile but I've been busy with exams and I'll probably switch this around a bit. Presently in code Plasmamen will heal when injected with plasma.

You can use the power disabling event to simply make it so power doesn't work, fullstop.

Well this is silly. Last I checked the shadowling ice-vein ability actually applied a short-term stun to borgs. If you have so many thralls as to warrant ten security borgs a romp through maintenance, you have enough thralls for one of them to grab the RD's ID and blow the borgs... Or enough to make an EMP, or enough to hand out flashes, or enough to grab the ion rifle. Need I continue?