Toroic

Currently at 2 weeks since fludd's last post, no feedback and it appears the changes that were requested were done.

Boy I love when bullshit like Taj veils gets speed merged but completed mechanical features are left without feedback for months. This is how you demonstrate good codebase management and encourage people to code anything but furry race features.

Is there some reason that the PR has been ready to merge with no comments or action taken in 16 days? This seems like a good, easy to revert change that someone worked hard on and over two weeks have passed since it was deemed ready without additional comments.

That's a good design goal. From what I've read of the code, when it comes to the races either the coders are afraid to add anything that innovates, or they don't have a good understanding of mechanics and player psychology. Kidan and grey both need major work. Kidan need something appealing, which they currently lack in exchange for the massive downside that is no eyewear. Allowing single click aggressive grabs would be appropiate in power level for that much of a tradeoff. Their armor is bad. Grey could be awesome with some short range (3 tile) telepathy. They already have some hefty downsides.

Wew lad I think you're overthinking it a little there, I don't even play diona but on paper they're mostly balanced. Not ideal, but "balanced", could probably do with another little something to make up for that speed loss. I don't play the pod people so it's good to have the opinion of someone who does. The speed reduction is the big negative they get, instead of throwing in a bunch of stuff about rads which would no doubt require IPC levels of code snowflaking probably better to just make them not quite so slow. I've murdered a lot of diona with plant spray and it is a bit overkill, having it act like acid for their skin that nullifies their regening and makes them rapidly become malnourished instead of a u ded spray would be better. And they're de facto space proof aren't they? Just need to bring a light source with them? Diona are already coded to gain nutrition and heal from rads. A lot of the little differences like that and glove clipping was purged because balance and species standardisation. Probably won't get back in since the gleichschaltung is ongoing. Removing the glove clipping doesn't make any sense to me. It just seems like a lazy move that buffs clawed races who are already better than humans mechanically.

I consider diona to be very much on the weak side, as someone who played them exclusively. Dionae have 4 major weaknesses. They're slow, viruses rapidly kill them, they can't wear hardshits, and plant-b-gone does like 50 toxin damage per spray. They used to heal toxin damage and have extra brute damage, and could benefit from genetics radiation and super speed. That was all nerfed and removed, leaving them in a sad state. Btw, diona are actually some of the most resistant to fire of all the species. There is no job that a diona does more effectively than a human. The lower speed kills their productivity and any job dealing with radiation or vacuum offers a hardsuit, which diona can't even use for the armor. From a lore perspective, diona feed on radiation, largely solar radiation but not exclusively. Personally, I think it's fine to have them gain nutrition from light, but cause them to rapidly lose nutrition while healing even in the light. Diona do have mouths and can eat and drink, but this would limit the sustained healing diona are capable of, as they would run out of nutrition amd then have their healing stop until they could build up enough for the next tick. You could also reduce their slowdown (but still leave them the slowest) and have them heal all four damage types at the rate that they heal burns. I'd support removing dionae mouths (meaning they can't stuff themselves and can only get nutrition from light and radiation) but that would make them immune to facehuggers.

It's appropiate that Diona aren't even on that list, because that's how much dev attention they get.

Greys have needed a boost to their telepathy for a long time. Currently they're outclassed by their PDA.

I personally think OP comes from a very different, casual style of game and seems to be missing the fundamental nature of ss13 as a disaster simulator, not a 2D second life. First comes competence, then roleplay, then the ability to do wacky shenanigans. If someone is not competent as a chemist and we don't have mutadone 40 minutes into the round (and 10 min after I ask for it) the only RP we're gonna have is me yelling at you to pull your shit together and threatening a demotion to assistant.

Sure. We already have dimunitive titles in many departments and mecha pilot would be a really bad idea. Above and beyond that we have the HoP who can provide any title and access, and the start of the round they're typically available to do so. So the response to OP's suggestion is that it's already in for medical (nurse) and engineering (maint tech), and for science learning from coworkers should be easy due to the departmental structure. Nothing more is needed. Whats bad in security cadet/deputy early availble for new players and which have reduced/no access initialy? Security have no junior version at all and potentially earlier availible brig physician a ment to be non-combatant kept out of actual crimefighting. And some Head of personal are just "no fun allowed" type. Security already has pretty limited access to begin with. Not sure the advantage of reducing it further. Sec officer is already a pretty low title and equivalent or worse in trust than a nurse anyway. I think that even if you want to the HoP and asked a "no fun" one for a title adjustment to reflect you being in training they would. Someone who doesn't have the social skills for that shouldn't be a sec officer to begin with.

It takes 0 seconds to not post a nonconstructive comment and move along. I point it out because the guy consistently starts with an incorrect assumption that wouldn't happen with a tiny bit of effort. Even for a thread about making fake (Jenkem is a hoax) drugs in permabrig, we can have standards. My opinion on it is that I'm not worried about what shenanigans people get into in perma, as I don't get arrested or play sec. The concept is pretty stupid, but for 2d spessman is fine, if we want to take a step towards goon tone.

Would it really be that hard to look it up before you spout nonsense? Takes like 10 seconds to look up the recipe for space lube.

It's almost like they're an interesting and unique race with situational advantages and disadvantages. Now, I'm not going to claim this was a shitpost by you, because you're serious about it. But your fundamental assumption (That being strong in some areas and weak in others is bad) is flawed and all the overwrought reasoning you've applied on top inherits this flaw.

For as much as you talk, I would've expected you have more to say. It is quite relevant in a discussion about justifying significant coding efforts in the sake of lore when the suggestion is made by someone who does not respect said lore.

Dionae aren't even a little overpowered. That's why out of 70 players 1-2 play dionae, about the same as skrell and grey, who have downsides without upsides. Diona upsides are mostly replaced with a hardsuit, and they can't benefit from hardsuit armor, upgrades, or beneficial viruses. As for the suggestion, I am going to have to disagree. Of course, what should we expect from someone with a name that doesn't fit the lore at all.

I don't think racial variety is really ever a bad thing, especially considering that we always have a few races with far larger than average distribution. Mass effect for example had a dozen or more races on the citadel, with no issues. However, if I had to choose I'd rather have newer races with more interesting mechanics than humans in costumes, so we could trim the list we already had. Vulpakin would obviously be the first to go, just being a clone of the much earlier established Taj. I'm kidding, but if vulp and skrell stay available races, there's always going to be room for more interesting ones. I personally don't see the value in species with near human abilities, and would also want all darkvision actually changed to be limited range night vision. As far as Resomi though, I think the people who play them will be annoying, and their hallucinating after being alone is dumb. But I like the idea of a hearing based species with worse vision who is also exceedingly fragile. 50 points of damage to crit is nothing.

How does their system work? http://wiki.ss13.co/Guide_to_Genetics It may be a TL;DR, but I encourage a full read of the guide, because Goon genetics is VERY different. You don't have DNA injectors by default for one. And DNA Injectors once researched, cost materials to even produce, so they don't just poop them out infinitely, meaning to spread mutations out via simple injectors, Geneticists have to continue doing work to accrue resources to make those injectors, etc. Otherwise you gotta go the long way an splice it manually. Also, everyone has randomized potential mutations innately, and these don't effect your Genetic Stability at all to have activated. (This is both positive and negative mutations) The only time stability comes into play is when using injectors to give powers not already latent in their genetic code. If Stability gets too low, bad things can happen. Such as randomly gibbing yourself. Negative mutations like obeisty and blindness and the sort, typically make your genes more stable, while beneficial ones typically make them less stable. So you can only have so many powers without also giving a few negatives to balance out. The guide will explain a fuckload better then me, so don't take my word on shit. This is a pretty good overview. Two major advantages is that you can easily get a few random powers but too many and too good of powers will quickly make things go badly unless you give yourself disabilities as well. It's a pretty fun system and you can call people with rare genes down to genetics to speed up getting something like say, hulk.

Lore is good, I like the theme and such for them. I think they're going to be one of those species that are weaker than humans, similar to greys or kidan, because fire and heat is a common type of damage and I'm not seeing that they'll get a lot of use out of the supercooled internals, though I could be wrong. Still, absolutely fantastic work and you've put a lot of work into coding them as well. Darksight is still pretty much worthless though, as it does nothing without mesons.

I really like how goon handles this, that is to say that each power gives negative or positive stability, and if your genes are too unstable, you mutate into a mindless mob for your hubris in taking too many.

Never been an issue for me. Doesn't mean it never happens to other people, dude. Well, that is a department culture problem, though the hop could easily give you your old job back, worst case. Other option is to go hide in a locker in maint, as if an antag is after you secrecy is the best policy. Of course, none of that makes the suggestion any less unnecessary.

Never been an issue for me.

Utterly unnecessary. If you're going to go afk, say you feel a short bout of SSD and log out. There's already rules in place to protect you, and you'll want a lot of witnesses. Basically what you're suggesting is both unnecessary and less effective than the current system, per usual.

I'd like to point out that currently darksight does nothing unless you're wearing mesons, and then it gives nightvision for that many tiles. But with naked eyes it does nothing, so it shouldn't be a major balancing factor.

...What? One person can set up the tesla and then the station is powered forever. Or they can just wire all the solars. If power is hard to maintain in weird hours, that's because there's not one competent player on to set up the engine/solars.

We play pretty fast and loose with the way defibs function anyway, but burn salve makes no sense to introduce. In real life, conducting gel is applied to the pads, and you wouldn't want that smeared on the chest. The electrical charge isn't going to burn anyone. If we're nerfing defibs I'd either reduce the number of shocks that you can do from full charge, increase the downtime between shocks, decrease the damage threshhold for reviving, or shorten the time you can revive someone.