Vivalas

Alright kinda confused here, are you proposing changes or something? Cause if you already know what github is and how to use it, might as well make a PR so that coders can see your changes and comment on them, if that's what you're looking for.

We don't even have to implement ZAS to achieve some emulation of decompression. Just increase the tickrate of the atmos controller and we get something even just barely dangerous.

While this seems like something a state of the art research station should be able to do with its access control systems (we see this type of thing in movies all the time), this would be way too hard on antags, and crew in general if a powertripping shitter lands in a command sport. Either way it seems like a bad idea. Streamlining demotions would be a huge help to security. Finding a way to surpress greytide more easily without fucking over antags is really hard. Although it sucks because in theory if all of security's very numerous tools were utilized by competent people, greytide would be dead.

Keep in mind most of these ideas aren't mine, and I really wasn't supporting the "no-slip" jackboots thing. The two things I think out of all of these that would make security 100x better is a brig officer job (which helps avoid security processing backlog which makes people super salty and helps to keeps order in brig), and the streamlined crime reporting / record system. Abuse of the system is a very real threat, and so I think being able to group crimes by their reporter (for mass deletion of crimes reported by a certain person), and being able to blacklist people from reporting crimes would fix this. You could even go so far as pre-emptively blacklisting assistants if you wanted.

Jesus without bombcap that bomb would have damn near destroyed the whole station, even from the testing range. Learning from Cuban Pete, are we?

Alright, so today I came across an interesting post on /r/ss13 asking the reddit what kind of changes could be made to make security better. And a few of the responses I read were really interesting. I've rolled security almost exclusively on all the servers I've played on during my spessman career, ranging from LRP to HRP, and each was a different experience. Security can be fun and rewarding with a competent and cohesive team, and.... downright cancerous to the crew and competent security players with a bad team. Nevertheless, I think Paradise security is the most rewarding and engaging out of all the servers I've played on, and I really like our system. On legacy Paradise before the relist, the system worked pretty damn well. It could get overworked at times, but with a competent team that was communicative and helpful, the workload was manageable and the station maintained a semblance of order. The brig remap just streamlined the process even more. However, the relist has stressed security and its players to the limit, which has highlighted a few issues with the system, mostly the inability for security to respond to threats or acknowledge reports of crime at best, and the complete break down of law and order at worst. As I was browsing through reddit I read some interesting ideas that I feel we should consider, if not put to the test, and the purpose of this thread was to try to create a healthy and contention free zone to try to discuss and brainstorm to develop an even more efficient and capable security system that is able to withstand insanely high workloads that are common during listing. Really the 3rd point here is the one I am referencing, but number 1 is also worth considering as well. Since I started playing security again, I played two rounds as warden, and both rounds quickly became overwhelmed with requests in processing, rowdy prisoners, perma prisoners robusting newbie officers, armory break ins, and a whole bunch of shit that stacks up and leaves you salty and leads to shitty treatment of prisoners. I think having a few "brig officer" or other job subordinate to the warden might accomplish this well. They could help in processing, help the brig medic with treating prisoners, watch perma, handle requests in the lobby, and in general act as a second hand to the warden. This would greatly streamline processing and help increase the efficiency of warden related tasks as described above. In the last quote here, everything leading up to the part about perma is my focus here, but the rest is interesting. You might see my point if you see the relations between these two quotes. Sure, crime reporting is decent and keeping records updated is streamlined when there are idle people around able to do that, or officers able to listen. But often in the chaos of a typical game mid-late round, petty crimes start to go unnoticed, or if things get really bad, anything that's not related to security's current backwash of petty crime and accusations of antags. Let's face it, relying on humans to keep records up to date and keep track of all crimes during a security overload period is unreliable even at best. Trying to filter out screams for help in the convoluted mess the chatlog is when everyone is screaming over security and general channels at the same time is nigh impossible, so what if we had a better solution? Well, we already have the underused request consoles that have an even more unused "report anonymous information" feature, so what if we expanded on this system? The idea of tying together records, automated record updating / easy crime entry, and crime reporting is every officer's dream, and if tied into radio chat / PDA messenging, would probably increase security's efficiency by at least double in high stress situations. An idea that came to mind was adding "crime kiosks" to hallways and major places that allow crew to report crimes, and maybe even add pictures or add witnesses that would be able to verify the credibility of the accusation. Perhaps even a PDA app that could be used to similar utility would be life changing. Tie this together with records and we have something coming together already. Another thing that fits in with connecting crime reporting with records is itemized crimes, meaning every crime is available as "objects" you can add or remove to people's records, or even add to crime reports. Add on metadata, such as time of infraction, location, status of crime, time served / sentence, arresting officer, and we have a database approaching a professional level. Of course we would have to verify and process these entries, but that would be something the aforementioned brig officers could help with. To try to show the utility of a system like this, let's use an example. Johanne Bach is assaulted by Mozart BallSacxz in the dormitory. He is punched a few times, tablestunned, and his ID is stolen. Having occured in the dormitory, there is a crime kiosk nearby. Had he just screamed "HELP IN DORMITORY ASSAULT BY MOZART BALLSACKS!!!" he would probably be ignored, but not because of this new revolutionary technology. He reports a case of assault and robbery, by Mozart Ballsacks in the dormitory using the device, adding on details of his ID being stolen, with the computer automatically adding the time of infraction (appending a "reported" to the end of the timestamp).After he submits this, a radio message is automatically sent over the security channel notifying officers of this, as well as PDA messages to the warden and HoS, as well as anyone in the chatroom the warden linked the announcer to. On the security records, under "Mozart Ballsacks", two new crime objects show up in his records with the status "pending". Additionally, every officer who sees Mozart will see a beige "I" above him on their HUD, for "Investigate". After processing a criminal, a brig officer gets a request over security comms for any crimes that need investigating. He finds his nearest records console, signs in, and uses the "pending" and "at large" filters. Mozart shows up with two pending crimes. Now, say Bach added a few witnesses in his report, these would show up under the crimes in Mozart's records, and after the brig officer talks with the witnesses and PDAs Bach himself, decides the crime is valid. He presses the big red "validate" button next to both crimes in Mozart's record, and he is automatically set to arrest, and the status of the crimes changes to "at large". Additonally the system notifies Mozart via PDA of the crimes he is now charged with and advises him to turn himself in if he wishes for possible reduced punishment, or to contest the charges. Okay, so Mozart was drinking in the bar, when an officer a few stools over got the radio message also sent over security comms by the system stating the new suspect with "at large" status and the details of the crime. The officer sees Mozart and the red "W" above his head, and detains him and brings him to the brig. (This next part about cuffs is optional) Due to the smartcuffs the officer has, the system automatically sets him to incarcerated and notifies over comms of his arrest, and the alleged crimes. If he had no crimes, it would give a warning that the arrest was made with no stated reason, leaving the officer to explain. The status of Mozart's crimes are now "arrested - awaiting processing". Now he brings him to the brig, and another brig officer drags him to a cell, searches him, and puts his name in the cell timer. The cell timer finds the two crimes in Mozart's records and automatically sets the timer, stating the minimum and maximum sentences to the officer (choosing the middle one by default), and clarifying the charges to the prisoner. Then, Mozart's status for his crimes is updated to "arrested - serving time", and the time served metadata for both crimes is updated according to his sentence. Finally, after serving time, Mozart is released (automatically updating records of course), and he is given a stern message by the cell timer to obey the law and work hard for Nanotrasen. Does this sound too badass to be true? Really it's well within what is possible if we decided to give it a shot and update our security records a bit to something other than Microsoft Excel. This system coordinates officers, makes them justify arrests, keeps records up to date, and keeps the legal team in the loop at all times. What more could you want? This could be expanded in a billion ways, such as making it easy to issue wanted notices on newscasters with a click of the button. Really the possibilities are endless. There are a few other honorable mentions I want to post here too that stood out a bit. Don't have much narrative for this, interesting idea worth discussing. This could be contentious for obvious reasons and might make it too hard on antags, but a watered down verson might be worth discussing. Finally there was something I wanted to add that I thought of myself. Whitelisting security has been suggested numerous times, and is often shot down. I can understand why, as it takss time and could deter new blood from entering thr security field. However, I thought about karma-locking it, and the idea grew on me. Now don't get me wrong, nothing outrageous, just a mere 1 or 2 karma points, maybe even that they don't get used in the purchase, just as a requirement to play the job. Security is always held to the highest standard, and understandably so, because they can make or break a round and really ruin the fun of other players because of the extra powers they have over other players as necessary to fufill their duties. Karma points are rewarded by other players, and generally as a result of positive interactions among players. Putting an arbitrarily small karma price on security would act as a sort of dynamic lock that new players could lift by themselves by having positive interactions with other players, something all security players should definitely be able to do. At the very least it would stop complete newbies from playing security until they learn the game and prevent griefers from taking the job. By ensuring players are able to interact positively with other players before allowing them to assume the responsibility and authority of security or command jobs (could maybe be extended to command as well), you go a long way towards increasing the quality of the players in those roles. And in my opinion, unless you have at least 1 karma point, you have no business playing command or security anyways. Anyways these are just some small ideas that could go a long way towards changing the way security functions on our server, and maybe in the SS13 community as well. Please discuss these ideas, and if you disagree please explain why. This is a brainstorm so constructive criticism is not only welcome but encouraged.

I really like this idea. Dogs should also be able to sniff out drugs.

>NV is useless and not game affecting at all. What. First of all this statement is wholly subjective, so we can argue about it all day, but I would much rather have NV over cold / heat resistance and maybe even pressure resistance. I mean, you have almost complete stealth in darkness, especially in maint where you can see people coming from a screen away because of their light source. In all games that have multiple species, including humans, the norm is usually that humans are baseline and average. With no drawbacks or advantages. Now, the problem here is Vulp have an advantage with absolutely no drawback. And sure, people cite realism, but that's useless here since if you're basing them off dogs, dogs don't have night vision, and if they're "unique" and not based on anything, then, well, you can't cite realism. And even if you did cite realism, realism is a touchy subject in SS13 because we tend to throw it in when necessary. Too much and the game is boring or too difficult, too little and you lose that complexity that makes the game interesting. The main argument here is that Vulp are the only race here with an advantage and no drawbacks. This should definitely be changed.

(from the same round) GLORY TO NANOTRASEN! FOLLOW ME TO GLORY COMRADES!

I don't like Vulp but besides my bias, they shouldn't have an advantage without any disadvantages.

This is probably the longest "pointless and stupid as fuck" thread I've ever seen. 4 [spoiler2]nice memes[/spoiler2]

Tau Ceti is russian High-RP server and it have cryosleepers in prison without any problems. And what RP you an even get if you are lone prisoner forgotten in perma by everyone because of some bigger shit happening? Its not fun to sit in four r-walls without any chances to change that. Cryosleeper is for that situations. If traitor knows that he will be rescued by his comrades he would never suicide/ghost out or cryo. So I see no problem in giving such opportunity. Perma is supposed to actually feel punishing ICly. This almost completely removes that suspension of disbelief. I wouldn't really call cryoing out as soon as you are arrested RP, the notion of adding cryosleepers to perma pretty much encourages that.

Cryo in perma has always seemed to me like a low RP thing that detracts from the atmosphere of the game. Sure I understand the point, but it defeats the purpose of perma if they jump in a cryosleeper and logout when caught. I don't really want to see cryosleepers anywhere but the dorm.

+1 to this. As someone who has played engineering extensively on Bay and who knows the ins and outs of the SM where that is the primary power source, I fully support this. (Yes, I know there is a slight difference between SM on different codebases). And no, the explosion is nowhere near as disruptive as a loose singulo. Shuttle is usually only called upon SM delamination in my experience due to the impending power failure unless engineering sets up solars, but most of the engineers are dead afterwards anyways. I also like the complexity and how fun it is to actually try to control it / cool it down / push it to the limit. When set up where the singulo usually is, it really only destroys engineering. When set up somewhere in engineering it would probably only damage medbay and cargo. Saying no "because it destroys 1/6th of the station" is not only false but also moot since all engines do significant damage to the station or crew and failure almost always leads to a shuttle call anyways unless command has enough balls to try again.

You really should only be in processing for major or capital crimes. As warden I get tired when officers drag petty assault and theft to processing. I usually throw them straight in a cell, since they get searched anyways over their cell locker by (competent) wardens anyways. If processing is overwhelmed because greytide, well usually greytide is small enough shit to where they shouldn't be there anyways.

I actually like this door idea, it keeps the quirky nature of slime anatomy while still being able to control.

Personal attacks aren't very constructive either nor do they help your cause. I wouldn't really call myself "new" here either. This is literally to encourage 'tide, you said yourself that greytide needs to be buffed to make them have a "chance" against security. I gave you plenty of constructive criticism in my first post, but if you want me to break down the parts I don't like: Flashbang protection: Nerfing security's only effective area stun weapon is a very bad idea, especially when it is a very effective tool for stopping / controlling large amounts of greytide. Also you need both ear + eye protection to be completely immune, so this will only reduce the duration of the stun (still a bad idea) And as for 100% disarm gloves, that sounds like a bad idea as well, considering disarm is already a bitch to security officers. This isn't so much "empower" the tide as it is "turn the tide into a god damn armed militia". So yes, I stand by my opinion that designing a set of gear to make greytide more powerful (when greytide doesn't need to be more powerful or encouraged) is not a good idea.

This sounds even worse to be honest.

Greytide does not need to be "buffed". Greytide is not supposed to exist in the firstplace and should definitely not be encouraged.

Get dat fukken WD-40.

The only way I would possibly be for this is if the "waterproof" vents / scrubbers as discussed on the PR were added and put in secure areas (captain's office, brig, etc.) otherwise it'll be Revenge of the Tide.

That's pretty much my thoughts whenever someone complains about sec being "OP" when they're not an antag. They're supposed to be OP vs. normal crew. If they can't even handle simple shitters easily, it defeats the purpose of them existing entirely. Nerfing security will just cause officers to find even more drastic measures to defend themselves. I do like the heart attack/ brute damage idea though. Both as incentive for officers to not use tazers as a first option, and as an incentive for people not to greytide. It should be made VERY clear though that if someone suffers a heart attack due to a tazer after being given ample warning and other nonlethal options have been employed, it is entirely the fault of the offender, not the officer.

Seems cool but sec armor is already pretty useless without its defense halved, especially after it was nerfed into the ground. I also like this. Bleeding can fuck you over if you don't get medical care fast. Tentative. Disarm punch should have a really long cooldown/ warmup period. Otherwise this is just no. Like this, as like the anti-secbelt. See above. Dear god no.

I think the only thing that fits into that category is the mini e-bow, unless you count revolver-groin shots. Is it long ranged though? I've never actually seen it being fired down any hallways. Have you ever seen a changeling/shadowling/wizard/cultist before? I mean honestly this won't change much. If this gets passed I'm just gonna start lobbing flashbangs at everything that moves.

Disablers are nice and all but they're inferior outside certain situations, flahsbangs are mostly used for actual crowd control as they should be. What gets me all sodium'd up the sheer betterness of the taser compared to everything else, it doesn't matter how it's balanced a golden bolt of sheer win will always come out on top unless syndie chems are involved. This really isn't even remotely true though. It is most definitely not a "sheer bolt of pure win". I don't know if you've ever played security, but if you have you're either insanely robust or really damn lucky. What I hate about security nerfs is that they make security susceptible to the tide (which is not at all the direction we should be going, and the fact that they always use a victimizing tone. Sorry you can't steal gloves from tech storage then yakety sax around when sec comes, and then your metabuddy can't break you out. Because this happens all the time. I'm not targetting you but the general population of the people who have the most issues with security - the ones who constantly break the rules. I usually ask those who want to nerf security to actually play it though, which is why I respect Spark's opnion. They are indeed a bit anticlimatic when you taze all the traitors than get drunk in the bar the rest of the round, but I think that they are definitely NOT overpowered. The majority of security nerfs are spawned by people who are on the "recieving" end of the baton, or electrode, with little consideration for those who actually play the most unforgiving, most stressful, and most hated job on the station.