Vivalas

Ohhhhhhh. Okay. I remember you asking this but couldn't figure it out myself. This was part of that awful spectrometry lab thing with the 20 different machines and the snowflake bunsen burner and a shit. Basically you had to prepare a sample by taking a rock sample, grinding it up, and adding chemicals to it, then heating it up. This would create sample fluid and a bunch of "waste" that you needed to skim out using a chemmaster. Then there were like a bajillion machines you could put it in to test with. It was a lot better when they got condensed into one.

As much as I hate the sec nerfcreep, I can probably drop my bias and get behind this. I agree disablers are more fun than tazers. I don't think tazers are at all overpowered, mind you, they can't shoot through windows and have a very limited range, but for most cases when catching antags offguard it can be anticlimatic. However, I'm still more of a believer of buffing antags rather than nerfing sec, because buffing antags makes the game more interesting and helps antags out, while nerfing sec makes it easier for antags, but also for shitters and self antags who shouldn't be doing what they're doing anyways. I honestly hate the mentality that created this suggestion, but like the suggestion itself. But it will probably get buried in a shitstorm of salt and drama.

It's kinda weird a major change like this doesn't have much discussion or contention. I'm going to put up a poll then, to gather a more formal opinion. I'm kinda weary of doing so though because some people who see polls immediately vote without actually reading.

This would be trivial to add.

Condenscending attitude aside, this is something I would support. The only issue I see is antags playing sec purely to roll security antag and if they don't just cryoing out. That said I've always been in opposition of denying features because people would use them improperly, so tentative +1.

Karma locking this will make it unused, as nobody (or maybe just me) would be okay with spending karma on something like this, unless it's like 1 karma or something. I think a player age limit and the ability to jobban people from this would be enough.

This would be cool as some sort of green newbie helmet with neurotransmitters or whatever in it that the HoP and department heads start with that they can give to newer players for a ghost (or mentor) to talk directly into their head and help them out. The helmet also tells everyone you're a newb.

This isn't true, read the debt system. Hospital bills are yet to be balanced, but some feedback on what you feel are appropriate medical costs would be appreciated. Goonstation's economy is about as useless as our economy, the only difference being that you can buy some neat toys if you get enough money, but people don't prioritize money really all that much on goon.

I like the colored frames but IMHO the wires underneath are meh.

Eh. I kinda like them being a unique thing to the warden. I can see the idea behind this, but the blueshield already has ample equipment to defend heads with.

The economy is supposed to be intentionally harsh, otherwise it falls back into obscurity as an underused thing. Things in the game actually need value, or nobody will use money. Unless you're buying 100 chocolate bars, that's not much, considering you get paid 500 every 20 minutes. For lower class, I agree it is more difficult, but that is intended. We could establish a value for a credit, but I feel like I like the way it is now. Lower paid crew will have to resort to other means to pay for gas tax, fines, and hospital bills, as well as food. Scrounging for supplies in maint to sell to cargo will be the main source of income for civilians, as well as tips if they actually help out. If we make it too "easy", it'd be like there is no economy, and we're back to where we were in the first place. Having to find interesting ways to make money sound pretty fun, even resorting to robbery to steal money from people. By making money an integral part of the game, we open up many different interesting experiences. A bazaar where people buy and sell junk. Assistants who peddle insulated gloves for cargo, money making schemes, shady contraband dealers in maint, the possibilities are endless. Right now none of this is really practical because money has no value.

Some good points you bring up, but work orders are completely optional. If the station is somehow turning a profit without them, they're not needed. Also whenever I play HoP I have pretty much the whole round to do absolutely nothing, but maybe that's just me. As far as work orders go, they're not meant to be a a compulsive "authorize me as soon as I am made" type thing, only when they are actually needed. And the interface is planned to be smooth and easy to use, like clicking a bunch of buttons in order, ACCEPT / DECLINE type thing. As for the CE, gas tax isn't meant to be a burden on any individual person, but I struggled to find a good income source. I don't think departments should be charged for repairs, and 40 credits an hour doesn't seem too burdensome. Of course the CE can jack the tax rates up, but that should be an IC thing really, with the captain telling him to turn them back to normal, or the crew just outright revolting.

This is an idea I have had in the works for a few months, and I posted it a couple times on other threads regarding reworks of our mostly unused economy infrastructure. The purpose of this thread is to get feedback for improving the proposed system, as well as gathering community support, as well as admin support, before working on this project, as it will be very wide reaching and change quite a few facets of gameplay. As this is a discussion post, please leave feedback and use constructive criticism. Thoughtless "-1"/drama/salt/"THIS IS THE MOST STUPID FUCKING IDEA EVER" without any explanation to why you do not like the proposed system or how to possibly improve it will be mostly ignored. Likewise, if you like the system, if possible explain what parts you like the most. This is a recycled post, so parts of it may be incomprehensible, but most of the meaning is there. I plan to fully implement this system myself if it is approved, and if it does it will be implemented in many small parts. (Large Wall of Text)

This honestly reminds me of a video I watched earlier today: I watched that after I saw it on Reddit. The whole 35 minutes too. The part where that one officer breaks a window on a car with his own hands by bending it backwards then just fucking rips the guy out reminded me off SS13 security for some reason.

CM indeed uses ZAS as it is based on baycode. ZAS works by dividing the map into zones. Like Rimworld. Confined spaces are their own zones, and so air transfers happen over the entire zone instanenously. If their is a breach in ZAS you will know because everyone in the room will immediately be flung towards the breach, or on higher difficulty settings, even sucked out the hole entirely. ZAS is great fun because generally idiots like to open those giant emergency doors and so air is constantly shifting around knocking people over. The downside is lag and occasional bugs that happen after fires or explosions that cause zones not to split and merge properly leading to wonky things happening. Linda is the shitty replacement we have, reskin of the older FEA engine that SS13 was designed on (I say designed on because SS13 started as an atmospheric simulation in BYOND). Linda uses a tile-by-tile method, which causes less lag but is generally more tame and boring because, say, if a room breaches, the air will very slowly and painfully shift over tile by tile until it decompresses. The downside to Linda is it is a literal hugbox and is boring as hell, plus the fact that playing engineering is a hassle because refilling rooms is a pain in the ass.

So far the only problems I see stated here are: 1. They are good at their job. So? Security Officers are too. I'd much rather play a regular sec officer than a borg. Stun immunity (but not really) isn't worth all the drawbacks. 2. People are dicks when playing them. This I agree with. But, so what? We have admins for a reason. If a sec borg is being shit, report the problem, so it actually gets fixed, so the asshole that is bad at playing sec borgs STOPS playing them. I've never been for removing features "because people can grief". The number of issues I've had with bad sec borg players is nowhere near the amount needed to justify this as a chronic problem that needs fixing. Just because you can't greytide with immunity then disarm spam the sec borg that comes to arrest your ass means that sec borgs are OP. They have a niche role, and that is about it. To summarize, officers are better all-round to everyday security tasks. They are adaptable. Greytider? Whip out the pepperspray. Greytide? Whip out the flashbangs and riot gear. Hostiles? Whip out the pew pews. Rogue engineer? Whip out the hardsuits. Sec borgs can do certain things better than officers, yes, but their overall performance is subpar. Their role is one of assault. Few people go up against sec borgs directly while unprepared. Their conventional stun immunity makes them great for prowling maintenance during high alerts without worrying about being killed or kidnapped. Their design is suited towards direct action and combat. If you go up against a borg 1v1 unprepared, you will lose every time. They are also decent against greytide (unless they have flashes), and have a few other uses, but they also have tons of disadvantages. They can't interact with most objects, meaning you can trap them easily. They can't navigate past panel'd doors like crew can by whacking the door with an ID, they have to recharge constantly, and probably the worst of all, one flash pretty much spells death for a cyborg unless they have backup. Not to mention their lack of an effective area stun weapon, or any sort of lethal ranged weapon short of being subverted. Security officers are more general purpose. Sec borgs are more specialized. The latter is not even closed to being OP, and eliminating an entire role is not really justified because some people play it badly.

When are the senseless security nerfs gonna stop? Secborgs are not super cops. They have to recharge, and can be robusted by pretty much anyone with a flash (or even a bucket of water). They have their niche role to fill, but by no means are they a game changer. They have their upsides and downsides, like regular officers.

>Arrsted for breaking into kitchen to steal knife, brutally assaulting chef, yakety saxing, and assaulting officers >Takes away tool belt >hey u cant strip me shitsec fuck >HAL!p shITSEC GREIFIng me!

Junior professions should be tied to the actual job, not to civilian. It would essentially be the same as joining as that job, but letting everyone also know you're new. As HoS I pretty much transfer everyone into security as a cadet with limited access, until they earn it.

It honestly seems like the OP would fit in better on a HRP server. I played on BS12 for about 3-4 years before coming here and its recent death saddens me. I had so many great memories with that station and the merc rounds were the best (I fucking played as a space hitler wrestler named the Fascist Fist as the whole merc team tried to wrestle the station for the champion belt. There are different kinds of servers because people have different tastes. I used to play HRP almost exclusively but started leaning to Paradise for something new, and I loved it. The pace was perfect, and, I've said it again and again, the perfect mix of RP and action. Well things have changed a bit, and that's not entirely true but I still like it. I really play in cycles. I used to switch between goon and Bay when I got tired of RP or got tired of mindless violence. I love engineering, med, and science on HRP because the RP is so fucking great (especially in science if you're creative, xenoarch used to be my honeypot). That's really the main reason I play command and security almost exclusively on Paradise, the other departments feel so meta'd out there's almost no need to play them. But rose-tinted rant aside, you probably should try a few rounds on Bay or Polaris. You might really like it. I wish there were more meta restrictions on Paradise, but I don't think it should be full HRP. When I first started playing here that balance was perfect and we've started shifting more towards the LRP end (3 big things: tesla, goonchem, and cryo auto-eject / magic defibs).

so this just happened gj admins

In my opinion magistrate should be whitelisted rather than karma-locked. It's too vital a role to the security process to be locked behind a karma wall.

This is assuming people aren't rule-lawyering assholes, which they are. If you tell someone to do something on code red and tell em "it's because code red, you need to listen to me" they'll go "the fuck it is, show me where officer". Almost all of SOP can be condensed into common sense. If you leave that bit out you can bet people won't follow it.

Wow this thread is approaching dangerous levels of salt, but I completely agree with everything here. I often compare paracode with baycode, given I played on bay for 3-4 years before I shifted here. When I first joined Paradise and it was listed, I loved it. The general atmosphere was great. There was always something going on, I remember half the station being blown up by the furry freedom force, and jist playing my violin and smoking with some Tajaran dude in the hallway as we complained about life. It was great. Now it just feels kinda dull. I loved paracode at first because it was a nice mix of bay and /tg/, but now we're leaning way too close to the /tg/ end of the spectrum. I miss the complexity and difficulty of baycode. I think medical and engineering have been completely ruined. I used to play engineering and medical almost all the time on bay, but now I rarely play engineering and barely ever touch medical. LINDA is absolute hugbox and the Tesla is a joke. There is literally no point in playing medical other than for surgery because of the almighty cryotube magical omnipotent healing machine. Sure, maybe it's Rose-tinted glasses, but I still remember my first few games of SS13 in 2012 and I miss it. And no I don't like retro SS13. I've downloaded and ran OpenSS13 and OldBay and both were utter shit.

8-Ball knows best. Clown threw it at me and so I picked it up and asked it a question. Abductor led security on a chase through primary hallway gunning at them as it ran. In the resulting shootout the thing was downed and this continued for like at least 30 seconds until the CMO started screaming that the damn thing was dead and there were cultists in medbay that needed dealing with.