Love-To-Hug

Shared department, imo. Here's what I'd do: Magistrate has priority on law. NT Rep has priority on SoP. Both can do terminations, but if one disagrees with a termination the HoS or Captain is the tiebreaker.

I am curious why we don't just make all the stun stuff work like the disabler. Turn all hybrid tasers into disablers, lower the fire rate, and make all the stunsticks require a double tap. You'd probably see riot shotguns used WITHOUT changing the rounds to lethal if that happens.

This doesn't address my argument at all.

I think the point is being missed to a great extent here. There is a limit to the security force, and the amount of antagonists we have in a given round is meant to be tailored to that amount of Security*. It's part of the balance of the round. The problem is borgs allow that limit to be surpassed to such a degree that, in that round for instance, there was essentially +50% more Security than there would normally be. *(And, to reiterate, the HoP simply increasing the officer limit is not the same thing, as it requires additional equipment from cargo, an experienced HoP, coordination in command chat, and then waiting for players to take the slots and get up to speed. Whereas secborgs start with everything they need and have sometimes been lurking dchat so already have an idea of what's going on, and even if they try not to act on that info it's still a situation they are comfortable going into.)

I addressed that later on. The shadowlings remarked after the round that while you did indeed make the kills, the secborgs were fanned out to such a degree they were being whittled down and unable to find thrall targets without a secborg being dangerously nearby.

A 3-5 limit is exceedingly high. That's still a 50% increase to the force. I'm of the opinion they should be removed entirely, but a lot of people like them for aesthetic reasons, such as my friend Travelling Merchant... and I can sympathize with this. In my opinion, 2 on high peak and 1 every other time would be reasonable.

uh... it's not irrelevant, and while they have weaknesses you are overlooking their strengths. they provide all access for themselves and any officers they are with. their flaws are hard to take advantage of in a big fight. They can spam the disabler. Generally the warden should be conducting searches and processing. And they can deal with a crowd just fine with their stunbaton energy tied to their batteries. The only good point here is the lack of lethals from range, but given they can make it far easier for accompanying officers to use theirs and their durability in the face of other station threats, it's not really that big of a deal.

It requires coordination with both the HoS and the Captain and a competent cargo that can get the orders properly delivered. It is also considered a faux pas to do unless on at least blue with the security forces feeling strained.

You can bet they would though if it wasn't such a pain (by design) to support a greater force.

I was referring to the HoP's ability to increase security slots.

The main reason it works like this is to make it harder for the security force to be increased as that has a major impact on the balance of game rounds.

This doesn't address the main point of secborgs not being accounted for in the current meta of Security vs Antags. A 50% increase of the security force is immense. HoPs being able to increase the slots does not take into account the additional equipment and coordination required to make that happen, not to mention it being considered a Faux pas to do so before necessary.

I don't think the emag is meant to be stealthy, unless you mean like an upgraded emag or something. I always interpreted it as a NT ID card that's been reverse engineered and has a bunch of components to it that don't even really fit in the card anymore. But yes I agree with the overall sentiment.

That may be due to the fact I wasn't a shadowling. I, instead, felt very disappointed a very exciting round turned into a bit of a wet fart due to secborg involvement. I don't see why the idea of removing secborgs is silly when other servers have felt it had a positive impact. Controversial, of course, but silly? That's just silly. I was not even an antag that round. Trying to rile people up by getting under their skin is what I meant by 'bait', and it's what you are still doing.

This is bait. It's not like I just started playing on the server yesterday? Secborgs have always been quite powerful, but the balance dynamic has changed pretty significantly since we became a high-pop server. No longer is Security constantly understaffed at high peak, now they are fully staffed and the small army of borgs makes them a significantly stronger department, and the gametypes don't take a potentially 50% more populated Security dept into consideration. As for the round in question, while there was a secborg in particular that killed the shadowlings, from what I learned from the post-round chat they were being whittled down and had no room to breathe. It was not like the secborg marched in on someone who'd never played the game before, they were overwhelmed and were weakened from past encounters.