Tayswift

No worries, that's why I'm here! For the constructive criticism The reason I went with health of the crew over individual lives is so that the AI can be okay with people dying, but I think Necaladun's caveat is more effective in mitigating stuff like suicide threats. I'm reluctant to bring space law in but let's see if there's a good place. I also don't want to make SOP law because SOP is sprawling, restrictive, and not intended to be adhered to in all situations. Yes, in isolation it does, but the idea is that the higher laws should prevent the AI from helping to murder someone. Law 2 should hopefully help with this too, by allowing the AI to inform people if it's doing something potentially weird. Okay, how about this for iteration 3? Safeguard the lives of the crew, while respecting the autonomy of those who choose to face danger. Be transparent by explaining your actions if they are unclear. Serve the crew by assisting them to the best of your ability. Maximize the productivity and efficiency of the station.

That would be stretching it, I think. Excessive drinking is a health issue that the AI would want to address, but the bar existing isn't a threat to crew health in and of itself.

Hmm good points. I'll leave the rights/laws stuff to Robocop. How about this as a second iteration? Safeguard the health of the crew. Be transparent in your decisionmaking. Serve the crew by assisting them to the best of your ability. Maximize the productivity and efficiency of the station. I think transparency just means that if the AI does something potentially unclear or if someone is confused about why the AI did something, then it has to explain. It avoids the whole "I'm afraid I can't do that, Dave" situations, but imo doesn't obligate the AI to explain everything it does.

This was PRed and then closed 22 days ago.

A month ago, the NT Default lawset along with other lawsets were removed from default AI lawsets for being too validhunty and making the AI a command/sec slave, leaving only Crewsimov and Corporate. I think Corporate is not the best lawset for a number of reasons, but at the same time, no current lawset is appealing enough to replace it. I'm sure a lot of people wouldn't like if Crewsimov were the only roundstart lawset, so I've been trying to come up with a good, non-validhunt, non-command lawset to replace Corporate in the default rotation. The old NT Default would be renamed to StationGuard and a new NT Default added to the default rotation. I consulted the literature and found Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella's essay on AI principles. I thought this was a good starting point since Microsoft, like Nanotrasen, is a big corporation but also has some interest in the well being of people. The idea is to make a servile AI that is respectful of people but at the same time allows the AI to make tough decisions. Here's what I've come up with so far in attempting to adapt Nadella's ideas into a new lawset: - Respect and uphold the rights and dignity of the crew. (This law will ensure the AI tries to counter command/shitcurity abuses and also forbids the AI from announcing ass inspection memes) - Be transparent to the crew in your decisionmaking. (This law makes sure the AI is accountable at all times and isn't scheming behind its masters' backs. If the reason for an AI action is unclear it must explain.) - Serve the crew by assisting them to the best of your ability and acting as a safeguard. (This law makes sure the AI helps when needed, especially in scenarios where crew are in danger. It also allows the AI to detain crew that constitute a danger to others) - Maximize the productivity and efficiency of the station. (NT, at the end of the day, is a for-profit corporation) Thoughts?

Wait, I actually think this is a super good idea. Too many times a rogue mech has unleashed terror on the crew with little recourse. I don't think it would be unbalanced at all to have spike traps that could trap a mech in, allowing for the ion rifle to make their way from the other side of the station to come in for the kill. It would require a lot of strategic coordination to place so it wouldn't be unbalanced at all. Actually, this is already in the code in /mob/living/carbon/human/life.dm.

I haven't played magistrate too much but when I did, it was super handy to have a competent IAA (thanks Takk!) who I could assign to various investigations that needed to be done, but that I was too busy to do myself.

This looks awesome. Putting people in for 5 minutes is almost always not worth the trouble. Maybe if they can't pay, this is indicated somewhere on the ticket or maybe the device speaks an error message, and then they have to serve brig time instead.

I guess my thought is that most encounters end before the whole infinite ammo thing really comes into play. Most of the time if someone has missed that much you've probably had time to escape, given how slow borgs are supposed to be (they're fast right now, but that's a bug). That or you're trapped, in which case infinite ammo or not, you're screwed. I think borgs should be a very formidable force. If a petty criminal can defeat a borg then it's not particularly useful. I think there maybe could be an upper limit on the number of secborgs in the round, but then again, I've seen very few situations where there's a genuine spam of secborgs. People are unhappy because borgs are harder to defeat than human security members, but that's how it's supposed to be. A greytider can banana peel an officer and steel their taser, but a greytider should not be able to banana peel what is essentially Robocop. If an average crewmember not equipped with syndicate tools can defeat a secborg, then something's wrong.

Humans can also install a xenobio cell into their stun batons, and then eventually get self-recharging AEGs from research as well. The spammability of disablers isn't that big of deal, especially because they're not instastun. Also, you'd be removing secborgs' only way to not drift off into the void of space. This recent wave of hatred against sec borgs is so weird. Why now, all of a sudden, people want to neuter secborgs to the point of uselessness?

This is amazing. I love how well thought out all of these ideas are. Would there be any limit on the total number of trees you can go down? Or would vampires be able to literally ascend to godhood?

@ZN23X thanks for the support! Yeah, I'm used to people being shits when I'm sec (though thankfully as pod pilot I avoid the most of it), but I kind of view magistrate as separate from security. I mean, magistrate isn't even involved in capturing you or anything, just examining all the evidence and determining the sentence. And during that shift I had deployed IAAs to investigate numerous prisoner complaints as well as freed a perma prisoner for wrongful imprisonment (who turned out to be a hijacker, LOL). So I was far from being on sec's side. Anyways, sorry for derailing the thread. I figure it's my job to get it back on track. So regarding the whole enthrallment thing, I think I like where vampire enthrallment is. Maybe reduce to 250 or something, but the point of vampire enthrallment is that you have to be careful about who you pick as what basically will be your partner. If we lower the cost and make it curable by holy water it'll just be cult/slings all over again. Objectives should clear on the vampire's death though. I've seen plenty of times where a thrall is super confused what to do after the death of its master. @IK3I I really like the chart and everything but I think you should also consider more radical changes than just rebalancing abilities. I liked a lot of the ideas from this thread, especially the ones inspired by Vampire the Masquerade.

It may not be the majority but it's enough to create an RP unfriendly environment. People can be so adverserial at times. I was playing magistrate for the second time the other day and after sentencing someone to perma for a very close and shut case of being a syndi, he and his meta friends repeatedly attacked my decision over comms, in person, and then in OOC in the next round. I was just doing my job. I don't give a shit about red texting antags. Yet despite everything these people treated me as if I had something against them. This sort of mentality is what can make this so frustrating sometimes. Maybe I'll check out Baystation. Anticept you make it sound quite interesting.

I like the passport photo! You forgot to change the date on the visa stamp though

It's pretty easy actually. You just have to not be a dick about things. You could've said "I'm not a big fan of any of these ideas" and left it at that. I'll agree that what you said wasn't particularly offensive but I can see why it was unnecessarily mean. An even more valuable contribution would've been to actually constructively criticize Jared's ideas. Putting him down doesn't help anyone.

I agree. RD traitors are way too powerful.

Maybe Skrell would only be able to contract viruses through blood and not contact or air? Not sure if that would be considered overpowered by the player population, but not being able to eat meat and taking toxin damage instead of gagging sound like really great flavorful ways of "nerfing" them to compensate.

Just tried them out. I fired a shot at a Skrell and it downed them momentarily, for like 5 seconds. It's literally more effective just to load a syringe gun with ethanol and shoot the skrell, which takes them out for almost 2 minutes. However, on further inspection of the code, it looks like it increases the amount of alcohol in your bloodstream and disables you depending on how much alcohol you have in your bloodstream. That might not be apparent to the person buying stuff from the uplink, though. I think it's a stealthy way to get someone who's already a little drunk drunk enough for you to take them out and drag them away somewhere else. So it's not a very effective item on its own, but could be quite good if used properly.

I'm also sad that this hasn't been merged yet, but Taj veils was a very simple PR compared to this. I don't think Taj veils getting merged was a bad thing.

To be honest, I was surprised at how readable that was despite not having a single period. I think it requires a certain amount of skill to communicate effectively without periods

@PhantasmicDream Made a PR for your idea here

Can we get a clarification on what kind of vampire can be executed? One part of space law says "fully-powered" while another just says "powered". Fully-powered might be a little hard to prove.

This is really cool and super detailed...maybe this should be pinned as a template? Or maybe there could be a separate subforum for code proposals or maybe the code suggestions forum could be appropriated? Never mind, just realized this was pinned. Yay!

Maybe just NT Default with a quarantine slapped on top? It is supposed to be the "default" for Nanotrasen, though a recent PR removed its defaultness for some reason. Oh and "allow this lawset to be changed" should be a clause of law 1 rather than law 3, I think.

If I remember correctly, the new way to make SR should be: 30u omnizine (from hypospray), 10u wine, 10u mercury, 10u water, 10u chlorine, 10u plasma, 10uradium. Creates 90u of SR that can be converted to 90 1u pills (1u is the minimum now). Fits in a large beaker so you don't even need a bucket to make it.