Varlun

I'm quite certain I've defibbed people that have been dead past 2 minutes. I usually examine corpses first to check the time of death. So I'm not willing to give up on that statistic yet. I disagree with you on cloning. It's not a last resort. If this were a more roleplay heavy server, then sure, you might have a case. And this server used to be that way. But it isn't anymore. From a purely mechanical standpoint- especially when the cloner has been upgraded- cloning is simply a much easier and FASTER solution to people that are badly damaged. I never said "Let them die and clone them." and I've never done that myself. Regardless of how bad they are, if they're alive, I try to keep them that way. But if they're severely busted up and they croak, I'll go ahead and drag them to the cloner instead of fighting the fight because I know they'd end up in surgery for at least several minutes, when it only takes about a minute to clone. It's just biomass. There's always plenty. And the cloning process is handled by machine, no labor required, whereas surgery obviously requires a surgeon. The surgery thing is mostly my personal preference, and my recommendation is what it is partially because it'll make it easier for people to get into medical. A lot of people are intimidated by surgery. Your message is exactly the opposite of what my guide is intended to send.

Currently we only have 1 for any single chemical we want, a couple more would be amazing! And a couple more syringes potentially as well, just to avoid the hassle of having to empty one to get a different chemical. But yeah multiple beakers would be great, even if they were small. One for mannitol, one for oculine... Please!

Hello! So, there's already a couple other good more in depth Medical guides out there, however for new players this really amounts to information overload. My intention with this guide is to just go over the essentials. If you can get this stuff down, you'll get by just fine in Medical. In my experience, what medical needs most isn't someone that knows everything, rather it just needs someone that can handle the chaos when chaos shows up. When you have a ton of patients coming in all at once and not enough doctors to treat them all, things can get pretty overwhelming. This is why I chose my cyborg name as Triage Unit, because my focus is mostly on sorting the dead or critical. Once those are handled, then I'll worry about further treatment. But in general, by that point, any of the other medical staff can handle it. So without further ado, let's get into it! --- CHEMICALS --- Let's start simple, with chemicals. I'm only going to cover the most basic and common chemicals. Like what the sleepers have, or the cyborg's hypospray, etc. I'm also not going to overwhelm you with specific healing per tick numbers and yada yada. You just need to know what they do and that's good enough. Charcoal - For toxin damage. No overdose point. Sleepers and cyborg hypospray have this. Saline glucose - Slowly heals burn and brute and helps regenerate blood. No overdose point. Sleepers and hypospray have this. Salbutamol - For suffocation. Not as fast as Epinephrine, but no overdose point. Sleepers have it. Epinephrine - Quickly heals suffocation. Cyborg hyposprays have it. While the sleepers don't have it, it's easy to get ahold of. EpiPens have it Mannitol - For brain damage. The medical vending machines have it. When people are cloned from an unupgraded cloner, they'll need one of these pills. Oculine - For eye damage. Vending machines. Strange Reagent - This is the revival drug. For newcomers to medical, I would avoid this entirely. It's only to be used in rare situations and it's not great because it does a lot of damage. That's all you need to know about chemicals to get by! --- REVIVING --- Sorting the dead is the first priority. This is probably the most complex part about medical, because there's many many ways people can be dead and many different things that can prevent people from being revived. Whether they ghosted, have been dead too long, have too much damage, closed the game, have too much brain damage... A corpse can be revived if it's been dead less than 5 minutes and has less than 180 total burn/brute damage. So the first thing you want to do is go ahead and scan them to check their damage. If burn/brute combined is over 180, heal them a bit to get below this point. Then attempt to use the defibrillator. There's 3 different FAILED revival messages you can get: Resuscitation failed - Severe tissue damage detected: This is from having more than 180 damage. Resuscitation failed - Heart tissue damage beyond point of no return for defibrillation: Been dead too long. Resuscitation failed: They're not revivable. Examine them (not with scanner, normal examine) to see if they committed suicide, or if they're catatonic (they ghosted). One neat trick that's good to do, if you want to be 100% sure whether you should be done with a corpse or not, throw them in a morgue slab real quick. Cyborgs will need someone with hands to help with this. The lights on the slab will tell you if they have a soul. Green or purple means they do, red means no. So you can forget about red, but otherwise you should seek further help. THE LIGHTS ONLY UPDATE WHEN THE SLAB IS CLOSED! You can either just hand them off or attempt to learn what's wrong and why you can't revive them. For 95% of cases though, you can get by without knowing that much! --- CLONING --- If all else fails, it's time to consider cloning. Vox and slime can't be cloned, and there's a couple other things that can prevent cloning. If you scan someone and see they are SUPER messed up, like everything is broken and 500+ damage and other nonsense... just clone them. There's no sense in having them stuck in surgery for an hour. Don't think of cloning as a last resort. So, when someone is placed in the cloning scanner, they get a popup (like terror spiders or w/e) to re-enter their body. If they're not in their body at the time of pressing scan, you get the "Mental interface error". So with autoprocessing turned off, it's important to try a few times to scan. Give them a chance to re-enter their body. It's still not a huge deal because if nothing else the Coroner SHOULD notice the purple/green light. I'd still go ahead and check yourself just to be sure, but take them back out. The Coroner will get mad if you just throw bodies into slabs and leave them. If autoprocessing is turned on, it will be constantly trying to re-scan, so just leave them in the scanner for a few seconds. If you want to be really productive when nothing else is going on, a great thing to do is to bring people in for clone pre-scanning. Use the crew manifest and your PDA (or equivalent as cyborg) and try to get all of Command, Medical, Research, Engineering, Security and Supply to come in. Myself, I usually just message the department heads and request that they tell their entire department at once to come in if they want. It's probably a good idea to target the miners FIRST, before they initially leave, in case the worst happens! --- CARDIAC ARREST --- I wanted to make a note here regarding cardiac arrest. When you scan someone with your health scanner that's in critical, it could tell you that they're in cardiac arrest. It's important to pay attention to what the cure is. There's 3 different cures. Epinephrine, saline glucose, and shock. If it's shock, you use a defibrillator. Cyborgs have a handheld defibrillator that's more handy for specifically this purpose. The more critical someone is, the more likely they'll go into various forms of cardiac arrest (Yes, they can get all 3 at once). So as general practice I like to go ahead and give them 20u of Epinephrine and Saline Glucose, then have my defib handy as I continue to scan them and monitor their health. A lot of times people will die during this process, because it takes a minute for it to be cured. No big deal, just defib them. --- SURGERY --- I recommend avoiding surgery. While necessary, it's a time consuming and sorta complicated process. I simply don't enjoy doing it myself so I refuse to do it. Remember how I mentioned that what medical needs isn't someone that knows everything, but someone that can essentially work triage when stuff starts hitting the fan? So, if you've healed up your patient but when you scan them it says they have fractures or broken bones or internal damage etc, take them to the chairs by surgery and call for a surgeon to that OR (left is OR1, right is OR2). In general you will be able to hand off people for surgery to other doctors. They need something to do after all, no sense in trying to do EVERYTHING yourself. And again, it's very time consuming, and while you're stuck in surgery there's potentially other critical or dead patients arriving in medbay that require far more immediate attention. --- SUIT SENSORS --- The lifeblood of medical, especially cyborgs (ESPECIALLY if you have multiple monitors!). I like to encourage all medical staff to check the suit sensors of patients themselves during treatment. If they REALLY don't want them maxed for whatever reason, they can turn them back down again after they leave. Drag their sprite onto yours, at the bottom you can toggle their sensors. Immediately after cloning someone, go ahead and scan them again! If they're part of the aforementioned departments. Don't pre-scan civilians or other people of less consequence. Pre-scanning is a very involved and time consuming thing to do but, can be very effective. It could surely result in antags deciding to blow up cloning, that's how you know you did a good job. One trick I like to do as cyborg, while I'm pre-scanning, I'll block them with my body on harm intent in the scanner so I can have time to toggle their sensors. Few people complain about this. Don't forget to handle suit sensors of the dead! Always toggle them off when putting them into the morgue! And if they're being cloned, AGAIN, go ahead and max them on their corpse before stripping them for the new body. --- That's about it, I'm sure I'll end up adding a little bit to this here and there, as I wrote all this off the top of my head. But that's most of it! Please leave a comment and let me know what you think!

Or just make it a separate option entirely. I often observe a round initially before becoming a cyborg. And I don't want to be spoiled as to what the antags are, it actually happens a lot that I'll see some antag communication in chat. Even with ghost radio disabled, it'll happen a lot. For some reason.

And you have contributed nothing to the discussion. Thank you for the random and completely unneeded insult.

Agent Che here is on point.

Woah, woah, woah. And now you're attacking him. Accusing him of being uncivil. Sure, he has a direct way of speaking, just like I do, but that doesn't mean he's being uncivil. I'm sure what he means is that your decision is "potentially" wrong. It can be difficult for us to come up with examples concrete enough to actually convince you, which is why we like to refer to the fact that most people involved in these conversations seem to be leaning toward- again, for Medical borgs specifically- giving them a few pick-me-ups. They feel a little too limited. I again point to the numerous threads I linked. Those are some very simple things, and if all of those were done I personally would be extremely happy with where Medical borgs stand. It's not like they're drastic changes. This wouldn't even require a shift in your design policy. At least as far as my suggestions are concerned. And I don't recall anyone else making suggestions that would require this change either (for example giving them hands)- and even if there are, I would say THOSE people are in the minority. But you don't care about majority/minority, do you? This whole conversation feels pointless. Every time we try to make even a simple suggestion, it seems like you rebound back to "working as intended" and don't want to change anything. And this gets turned into a whole philsophical debate about whether medical borgs should be more powerful or not, when all we wanted was just simple little quality of life improvements or very small improvements- again, like the threads I linked.

Don't worry about me, lol. I'm not getting frustrated. I'm just saying how it is.

They don't care about polls, they don't care about popular opinion. They care about their vision.

I don't think many people are actually pushing for hands or radical increases like that. I am mostly fine with current Borg functionality. I just wish that functionality was -better-. I don't think Medical borgs should be able to do every part of medical, but as for the parts they ALREADY do, I wish they could do that BETTER. I reference you to the threads I just linked as good examples.

Since I think it's relevant to this thread, I'm going to take this opportunity to link to those threads I mentioned. I'm not necessarily trying to argue that medical borgs should be way more powerful or given drastically better functionality (I'm definitely not an advocate for hands). These are some really simple suggestions that for the most part are quality of life.

I understand what you're saying. However, for one thing, from what I've seen it's somewhat rare to have more than 1 or especially 2 medical borgs. When I play medical borg myself (which is always), it's very very rare for there to be a second medical borg. And as far as myself is concerned, I operate as an emergency response unit. I only worry about the most critical of situations. Literally people in crit, or people who have died, or people suddenly accumulating damage on the crew monitor at the far end of the station. Most of the time I sit in the medical lobby, waiting for things to happen. But the point I'm trying to make is, that if there is another doctor around who is able to tend to someone, I let them. I don't purposefully try to occupy myself- just the opposite. I don't need to be tied up with someone who could otherwise be taken care of by another doctor, when something else goes wrong that could need my attention. If I'm busy in the rest of medbay, I won't be there to respond to the dead/critical people brought in through the lobby. So I am a fallback. I'm not saying that's how all medical borgs operate, but it's what I do. And again I'm talking about medical borgs specifically. All that being said, I do understand that if medical borgs (and borgs in general) were improved to the point where suddenly a bunch of people want to play them, then sure, this could be a concern. But for another thing, the job slots do not automatically adjust as the round goes on. Paradise is a really popular server, and the job slots will be the same if there's 20 people playing or 80. They have to be manually changed by the HOP. I'm gonna guess that basically doesn't happen. So if anything you should be thanking Borgs for assisting with needed roles, as opposed to having more graytide.

Your post is completely self-contradictory. The fact that Borgs DON'T take up job slots, means they literally don't "take anyone's jobs". If they DID take up job slots, THEY WOULD LITERALLY PREVENT OTHER PEOPLE FROM TAKING THOSE JOBS. So, while I agree with you on the arbitrary restrictions, your idea of making them take up job slots is absurd, and in fact directly goes against what you yourself want. The mentality of "They took our jobs" is in fact very, very wrong. Borgs are just there. They're not stopping the humans from being there too. Also, as far as IPCs, they are literally just metal humans. They don't have any different functionality- they're not borgs. That's why people have no problem with them.

I agree. Tully claims Cyborgs are supposed to be side-grades, but all in all- at least in terms of the mediborg- they feel very underpowered compared to their human counterparts. They feel like a downgrade. And I'm not even talking about the lack of free will, etc. I mean just talking about the amount of tools on hand. The infinite chemicals and defib is really nice, sure, and I'm not saying medborgs need to be THAT much more powerful (I've made several threads regarding things that I think should change), but I think the basic design philosophy needs to change so that Cyborgs are expected to be better at their specific jobs than their human counterparts. Humans are flexible. Borgs are not. Humans are jacks of all trades, masters of none. BORGS SHOULD BE THE MASTERS.

This guy gets it.

That wouldn't be very helpful. A text notification for each specific thing is what's needed.

I actually disagree with it being any kind of audible notification. At least for medical borg specifically, dings would be happening CONSTANTLY. It would get pretty annoying. I would prefer a text notification. A UI element would be nice, but I know that's asking for a bit much. Just a simple line of text "Charcoal fully synthesized." "Epinephrine fully synthesized." "Advanced burn kit fully restocked." "Nanite paste fully restocked."

For one thing, the kits are typically stashed inside other kits. I pretty much never see any laying around that I can do that with. For another thing, that doesn't really solve the problem. In the field, I ultimately only have access to the one kit. For ANOTHER thing, that still wouldn't solve the problem with the nanite paste.

I'm gonna make a separate thread regarding having all 4 chemicals charge. Because I can.

There's a few things I need to clarify, first. I am suggesting this as a replacement to the individual burn/trauma kits. The reason I pick synth flesh is because (I'm pretty sure) it heals both burn and brute. I've never used synth flesh myself, so my knowledge is limited. However, from what I have seen, synth flesh seems to completely heal people. I'm not even certain if it's a patch, like the trauma kits, or if it's a chemical. Because if it was a patch that would imply that each damaged body parts needs to be targeted, but it seems like the doctor just slaps on some synth flesh and boom, perfect health. If this is indeed how synth flesh works, then clearly that would be pretty overpowered to have that on a borg. Especially if you make it able to recharge over time, as I have made another thread about. So there's two options here: Either you can change the way synthflesh works specifically for the medical borg, in order to balance it having it. Or you give it some alternative which is less powerful than synth flesh, but still more powerful than the burn and trauma kits. Really, the critical thing I want here is to have a single module that can heal burn and brute, rather than having to switch between the burn and trauma kits. I am primarily for the first option. My idea of balancing synth flesh is basically to make it work like the burn and trauma kits already do. First, make it so you have to target the specific body parts, rather than having it heal the entire body at once which it seems to do. Second, as for the STRENGTH of it. I do not think that a single application of this should fully heal that body part. I assume this happens with the synth flesh doctors use, because they probably make the unit count really high. Again, not super familiar with this stuff, not even sure if it's a chemical or not or if it even HAS units attributed to it. But regardless, the strength of it should be the same as the burn/trauma kits. Let's say the burn and trauma kits heal for, idk, 50 damage. I don't think it's that high but whatever. So the synth flesh would attempt to equally heal 25 burn and 25 brute damage. If one damage type can't be healed for that amount, the remainder would apply to the other type. Third. With the burn/trauma kits, you are only able to use it on any given body part ONCE. After that it tells you their wounds have already been tended to or whatever. I don't know if this already applies to synth flesh, but as far as the cyborg using it is concerned, this should be a limitation. As for the second option: Perhaps it would be simpler (and less confusing to people who actually use synth flesh) to just create a new kit specifically for the cyborg, which functions exactly as I've described above. BASICALLY what I'm getting at here is I want something that is like the burn and trauma kits, except with a single module.

Medical borgs only get one of each of these items- burn kit, trauma kit, nanite paste- which has the same number of uses as the normal items. Meaning they run out very quickly. They have to be recharged at the charging station. I think it's like 5 uses on the kits. I feel like I need to be so conservative with the kits, that I literally only use them in order to heal someone enough so they can be defibbed. A paramedic or a doctor, on the other hand, has the option of stuffing SEVERAL of these kits in their backpack. As far as the nanite paste, I LITERALLY CAN'T EVEN HEAL EVERY BODY PART on an IPC before the charges run out. It's unbelievably frustrating. If I have to heal an IPC, I will drag them to the charging station. I'll heal what I can, pop in the charging station, restore the paste, pop out, heal more, rinse and repeat. I don't know how many charges the paste has. MAYBE 10? Let's count the body parts: Head, torso, pelvis, arms, legs, hands, feet. That's 11 parts. And please don't forget that often, if certain parts are damaged enough, they need to receive more than just one dose of paste. So needless to say it's pretty goddamn annoying. Now, I'm not saying it should just have infinite uses. Not quite that simple. I'm saying it should work more like the chemicals in the hypospray do. You use them, and they recharge over time. It's not super fast, it's not super slow. But at least you don't have to visit the charge station constantly. I don't know if the hypospray consumes battery when it's synthesizing chemicals, but if you really felt like you needed to balance this, just make it consume some battery charge as it's replacing charges. So that if you do a whole lot real quick, sure you would need to go top off your energy, but at least you would be able to fully heal a patient or two before having to recharge. CAN'T EVEN HEAL A SINGLE IPC! And as a last-ditch suggestion, if for some reason people don't feel like this would be balanced (and let me just say- it fucking is), then at the very least could you please, PLEASE increase the charges these things have. Anyway, as for balance: This is absolutely balanced. As I mentioned, human doctors can stuff SEVERAL kits in their backpack. Human doctors have access to every chemical that exists. Stuff like Synthflesh which is just amazing. You know what, fuck the burn and trauma kits. Give the medical borgs a synth flesh applicator instead. And make that recharge. I'll probably make a separate thread for this. Also, random suggestion: It would be nice if there was some kinda notification to let us know when our stuff was fully charged. This includes the hypospray (each specific chemical), the kits, and nanite paste. Because as it stands, when you're sitting in the charging station to restock your kits/paste, you don't know how long you have to wait. There's no indicator at all, no way to find out. And for the hypospray, it recharges outside the charging station, but still, each chemical only charges while you actually have that chemical chosen with the hypospray. So an indicator would be nice so I know when to switch to a different chemical so I can start charging that one. For that matter, it would also be nice if all 4 charged without needing to be selected. Not necessarily at the same time. It would start with the one you have selected then move on to others, starting with the most depleted. I'll probably make a separate thread for this.

We've talked about this. I kinda wish you would give up on that train of thought. Non-borgs are VERSATILE. Borgs give up this versatility in order to excel at something specific. A medical doctor, for example, could grab any weapon they wanted and suddenly be able to kill more efficiently than a borg ever could. Human doctors, for another example, have access to every chemical that can be made. Advanced things such as synth flesh which are amazing. Mediborg can only use the 4 chemicals in their hypospray. Cyborgs have infinite Saline-Glucose, sure, but it's really really slow to heal. Mediborgs have a single burn and trauma kit which has the same number of uses as normal ones, before we need to resupply at a charge station. A human doctor can keep SEVERAL of these kits in their backpack. And please don't forget that human doctors are typically chilling right there in medbay, where they have easy access to additional supplies, not to mention the cryo tubes and sleepers. Meanwhile, I as a Mediborg typically act as a super Paramedic. Always watching the crew monitor, if someone gets injured or dies, I'll rush to them using my all access. So it's pretty frustrating to have an extremely limited number of charges on those burn/trauma kits. If you ask me, Mediborgs can stand to be buffed a fair amount. This has inspired me to make another thread, so keep an eye out for that. Edit: I ended up making FOUR threads, lol. Anyway, as for the thread topic. I definitely don't think security borgs should have the stun removed. Maybe an upgrade, as others have mentioned, that would reduce the duration. But flashes are basically the only counter to borgs so it would be pretty dumb to remove it.

That would work.

You're slightly wrong there. Help intent has nothing to do with it. It would work on help or harm intent.