Earthdivine

As the person who did that, I do apologize as it was more to prove a point then anything. However I don't mind this as all, and I understand where you're coming from. We probably should keep that to the lobby.

Yes I just learned that a few hours ago S:

Uh, when I think Peacekeeper Borgs, i think the Nation ones that can only use Tasers and Handcuffs that don't follow spacelaw.

Quite honestly Secborgs are only good against the stealth antags who usually have means of shutting them down. Secborgs have NO lethal options outside of baton-bashing, leaving them to deal with Traitors, Vampires (who often can jaunt away or poof away to a maintenance) or Changling (EMP Schreech, then bash their head in, they have very little HP to use.) They can't do anything against the other antag types (sans heist) due to their lack of lethal means, making them a glorified bullet sheild for security. I will completely admit Secborgs are usually played by players who aren't fun to play them. Also goon secborgs had other things going for them we dont, like moving faster then players, bigger hp pools, and lethals, allowing them to powercop without fear. I play secborg very often (I am the custom sprite HELIOS) so i know alot about their ins and outs, and they are really underpowered in areas.

Mel only wishes one person to have access to the server computer at a time for security reasons (only 2 places the password can be stolen from rather then say, 6) and also so we do not have a conflict of interest between people who have access, which was something we had in the past when more people had access at once.

Please take the time to think out your responses, as this comes off as uninformed. We have been pushing tons of anti-meta and powergaming things through as we can without tearing things apart, not to mention our constant posts on powergaming/lowered RP and how we're working on it. The biggest problem with proposing and going through with something like this is the loss of community. SS13 is honestly a stagnated community. We don't get new players coming in unless some big name decides to give us publicity. We can't just brute force this stuff or ban out the playerbase because there's so little players to ask to adjust to this. We already are down to 50 from 100 players since the listing to decrease the amount of greytide and attempt to help what roleplay we still had left. Changing the rules to such would probably push that player count to 30 or lower, making the station into a ghost town and lowering the productivity and more. That's not even to mention the fact we have attempted this in the past and there's a reason we do not have the rules anymore.

Everytime I see this I think people remember a different game. The Limited Knowledge rules were really bad, as bad as the loyalty implant forced RP was. We constantly were getting complaints to no end about how "X couldn't have known this!" or "Y said his cousin said this, its against the rules". Not to mention when say a Civvy stepped in to help medbay, we would get reports saying such, "An assistant shouldn't know how to do surgery" and would often also try to remove them with CH, which often times resulted in death if the medical player was new.

A wizard who only wanted to get drunk and created an army out of the people who denyed her drinks. Hah, sounds like fun. Ask Tully about, he had a front row seat :3

A wizard who only wanted to get drunk and created an army out of the people who denyed her drinks. That looks like it was a fun round to be in.

I had done something like that, asking players the round before if they wanted to participate in an undercover Nuke Ops VIP Kidnapping. It had started pretty well, though a bit of a flop since our VIP, Dave, walked headfirst into the group as soon as they boarded, so we improved and made a negotiation announcement. Only 2 people cared, the NT Rep and the Captain, the latter of which got captured as well after he tried busting out the VIP. It wasn't a complete waste, the Nuke Ops enjoyed the hostage banter they made up, the VIP and Captain tried to break free twice I believe, but no one else cared, despite us telling command constantly the Captain and VIP were missing, and asking the crew to assist in the search before CC had to pay outrageous funds for both to come back safely We can't really let a story unfold around the station with the events because the station will completely ignore it. The events that seemed to be well liked are the ones the players can't ignore, so that brings more people in to muddle it up or create their own stories about it.

Very much this. We been trying to nudge it away from the Powergamer mentality and more to a Roleplay sense with the SoP and Space Law, but even then we have the issue of its entirely up to the community to actually be the change, and that more then likely won't happen due to how many people seem to very much think the game should be "Us versus Them".

We had the code for this a long time ago, it couldn't work with our DNA system, so it was either GoonDNA/genetics or what we have now. I hope Fox can (dis)prove this?

Xray completely negates darkness as far as I know. Maybe it wasn't like that in the past? Defiantly isnt how it used to be, before you needed to have Mesons on to attain that. I'm guessing this was buffed when we changed our lighting. I haven't played genetics for a long time due to how boring the job is and I felt bad for having the potential to ruin an antags round just by existing.

no thanks, X-Ray is a vanilla power, it's been the same for fucking years, literally one of the original 4 powers Changing it won't change many problems that are associated with it (other then Antag powers acting strange, such as room-wide Shadowling glares). As for what Thermals does, it is just seeing people through the walls, without seeing the areas in which they are in. Infact it's more powerful because you still have darkness obscuring people with Xray, you cant hide anywhere with thermals. At the moment the problem with Genetics is more how ridiculously easy it is now. Most geneticist players can get a full set of powers in 20-30 minutes.

Actually we had the rules like this before, back when the server was new. It got changed because people ignored it all the time and made the dumbest excuses to explain why they knew the things they did. That's honestly the crux of my argument with this. It's been done before and failed horribly. Don't repeat the past.

Don't mean to post again so fast, but this is very much a big factor of why the "Wow" factor of the game is gone. Remember how cool you felt doing R&D and figured out "Wow I can get these research points with this? I need to remember that for next time"? You can't ever experiment with R&D anymore to learn that. A scientist or RD will barge in and start cramming the thing to max in 10 minutes, and point you to the handy R&D Guide or program to have it done for you. If you don't let them max their toy then you get scrutinized for it. The powergaming mentality is getting so strong it's strangling the game now. My first night back I saw someone make a side comment, "Well we got the wizard, quiet shift from here on out." I was honestly real saddened by that and made me want to just spawn in a bunch of mobs to assault the station with.

Baycode might be more appealing to port if it wasn't so hideously awful. The RIG systems is a good example of that. And wow this thread really is rose tinted glasses. The only department that has it easy compared to days of old is engineering. People who say Medical is brainless obviously forgotten how powerful Chems were healing wise. Atleast you need to actually use patches and chems side by side now, before bruise gel and ointment were god awful compared to giving someone a Dyvolene+Bicardine+Dermaline+Dexaline Plus pill, which could be completely stocked for a whole shift by 30 minutes if the chemist was good. Hell I survived a full 20 minutes in soft crit because I was given one of those pills And I never once died dispite having multiple bullet wounds, a virus, and been lasered to near death in a Rev round. Lets not forget our good friend mister Chloral Hydrate + Sleep Toxin, which is by FAR more powerful of a chem combination then any Hell chem mix in terms of being stealthy. Add in Sulphuric Acid to get around hardsuits and biosuits. Everytime I hear groaning about Atmos being too easy I have to shake my head and wonder what atmos you all are thinking of. All i remember is Admins having to intervene multiple times during large fires because Atmos grinds to a halt, a single window breaking venting the whole station and pressure never recovering, and no one EVER touching atmos except to do projects that yield the exact same results as current day. Remember we had to turn off Pyroclastic Anomalies because a single one spawning melted entire departments, even when it's defused just because it spawns plasma? Or whenever engineering gets flooded with Plasma, Science was flooded as well because that's how Atmos worked. And quite honestly, nothing looks complex to you all now because you solved it. You know the ins and outs. The station is very hugbox because the community has driven itself away from a station based around "Work place accidents" and "Budget Cost Employees" to what we have now. "Balancing" the game did shit (Except Tasers, which is still better then "Tased twice, down and out forever"). I already had a big effort post about the community and how much they feel safe and sound, and the rise of "Us vs Them" mentality of the station and antags and don't really want to type it all again. If anything is to blame for the loss of how SS13 used to be, it's the SS13 community itself. If it wasn't, wouldn't this balancing issue just be our server?

There's already a Holodeck. Could use that.

I'm sorry, "shooting as fast as I can click" is not a good idea no matter what.

To be honest I would be fine with this as long as they don't get to pick their second objective, because everyone would just take Hijack to have no rules.

I'm not sure about the implications or fun of having the antags fight each other, but - as far as wiz/malf/blob goes - shouldn't it be possible to make it so that once all of them die, the round ends? Instead of having the game check the death of one antag, it would just check all three. Or maybe it doesn't work how I expect. We have been trying to do that with the Ragin Mages game mode and we been having some issues with it of late.

It got changed at some point I believe. Forgot when it happened, might have been a consequence of the Character Preferences changes.

Including its owner appearently.

Well I mean, that's the reason we got rid of round-start NT Default, because the AI's were being shitlers and killing anyone that harms the station or remotely looked antaggy.

You can easily get Insuls from cargo, if it's absolutly nesscary. As a round start item thats a far bit to ask, as the RD SHOULDN'T be doing the engineers work of door repair, machine tampering and what not. Infact the only thing they would want to use them for is the Autolathe, and you can ask an Engineer to do it. The most this will do is make an RD even more of a nightmare for a Malf AI.