Walk when you are pulling someone

[ZN23X]

Also hurts things balance wise. This would give cultists even more time to teleport out of custody before being de-converted. It would get to the point where it becomes common to KOS cultists once we know they can teleport. In changeling rounds, officers would be required to carry around a scalpel and saw to behead any changelings they kill on the closest table as it would take too long to drag them to surgery or the cremator. 

I don't see the benefit of making security, which is already struggling to maintain a solid base of experienced players, even more difficult and less attractive to play.

Not sure why I'm argueing this. There is obviously enough push back so this will never come to be. Good luck.

[FPK]

Alright, I'm going to make the comparison to goon again. They reverted most of the pulling changes, a move that I don't really agree with but I understand why it was reverted. There's a feedback thread up on their forums discussing the pulling changes, I suggest reading it to get a better understanding of what it's like to have this feature.

Currently on goon, only pulling people slows you down, but only if they're incapacitated or don't have help intent turned on. Pulling containers with bodies in them also slows you down. In practice, this makes dragging off unconscious and unwilling captives slightly harder, but not impossible. I suppose walking is much faster on goon than it is here (make walking a little faster, please!), but the slowdown effect is hardly game breaking, and instead nerds the "stun+drag away to hell" technique that most players rely on, which can be nearly impossible to combat if the kidnapper has extra movespeed, or additional access like vox (space isn't all access).

[Machofish]

If the big thing this is meant to address is the ridiculousness of speedboosted antags using the tactic of "stun -> drag victim all the way across the station before the stun even wears off -> kill, dispose body -> rinse -> repeat", then make it specifically that pulling or dragging forces someone to run at default or the slightly reduced speed of being hungry/underfed, where it's feasibly possible to give chase, or at least force the antag to choose between keeping their victim/hostage or being able to make a speedy getaway instead of doing both. At present, any antag with a steady supply of meth and a stun weapon, or even one cultist with the flagellant robes and stun talismans have all they need to steadily, single-handedly grind down the entire sec department over time unless someone in security has a faster-than-light internet connection and the reflexes of a housefly hopped up on caffeine and redbull.

[The Respected Man]

3 hours ago, FPK said:

 

Currently on goon, only pulling people slows you down, but only if they're incapacitated or don't have help intent turned on. Pulling containers with bodies in them also slows you down. In practice, this makes dragging off unconscious and unwilling captives slightly harder, but not impossible. I suppose walking is much faster on goon than it is here (make walking a little faster, please!), but the slowdown effect is hardly game breaking, and instead nerds the "stun+drag away to hell" technique that most players rely on, which can be nearly impossible to combat if the kidnapper has extra movespeed, or additional access like vox (space isn't all access).

This is pretty ideal. 

[Shadeykins]

Make it apply only to someone who is being pulled whilst on the ground.

 

That way dead bodies are hard to move, whilst the handcuffed person is forced to shuffle along.

[MarsMond]

43 minutes ago, Shadeykins said:

Make it apply only to someone who is being pulled whilst on the ground.

Getting dragged by someone you don't want to get dragged from? Hit rest, and annoy him with either slow movespeed, or needing to keep to shake you up.

[Keroman]

I think it might be a good idea to try this out for a few rounds and get some input from the players who had to deal with it.  It sounds like it works well enough on some other servers but it may or may not work well with Paracode and the general playstyle of our population.

It doesn't seem like the most difficult thing to code, although I wouldn't know for sure.  As long as players have the option to strap people into roller beds, office chairs (the ones with caster wheels), wheelchairs, etc. for full-speed dragging then I think that it would be a fine addition.

[Shadeykins]

9 hours ago, MarsMond said:

Getting dragged by someone you don't want to get dragged from? Hit rest, and annoy him with either slow movespeed, or needing to keep to shake you up.

Pretty easy to shake people up, though, and rest has a cooldown time.

[Spacemanspark]

On 6/28/2017 at 1:21 PM, MarsMond said:

Getting dragged by someone you don't want to get dragged from? Hit rest, and annoy him with either slow movespeed, or needing to keep to shake you up.

I mean, from a logic standpoint it makes sense.

And it's not an issue, honestly 

[scrubmcnoob]

Couldn't greyshirts just rest when security is dragging them making the trip that much longer? This will really slow the game down for transporting people and I'm not really in support of that.

[necaladun]

Shake them up i guess. I'd classify it as resisting, too..though they likely have already

[Dinarzad]

2 hours ago, scrubmcnoob said:

Couldn't greyshirts just rest when security is dragging them making the trip that much longer? This will really slow the game down for transporting people and I'm not really in support of that.

Rollerbeds.
Act like a lunatic, get treated like a lunatic, strap 'em down.

Edited June 30, 2017 by Dinarzad

[FPK]

While I approve having a slowdown effect while dragging someone who has harm intent on or is incapacitated, I don't think it should be walking speed. Walking speed is unbearably slow, so much that walking serves no purpose other than to prevent slipping or during low chaos RP scenarios (office RP)

[Buford]

Honestly when a server revolves around antagonists (Which are severely under powered and outnumbered) for game play and them being the only people that are allowed to kill or even put people under critical condition by game rules is trash. Now if the game rules were tweaked so that non-antagonists could put people in critical condition and even kill if role play conditions were met I would support this otherwise throw it away.

[Rumiluntti]

1 hour ago, Buford said:

Honestly when a server revolves around antagonists (Which are severely under powered and outnumbered) for game play and them being the only people that are allowed to kill or even put people under critical condition by game rules is trash. Now if the game rules were tweaked so that non-antagonists could put people in critical condition and even kill if role play conditions were met I would support this otherwise throw it away.

Greytider wet dream.
Also, impossible to make rules on what are the mysterious "roleplay conditions"

On the topic itself, making the meta of jakkety saxing while harmbatoning the victim die would be fine by me.

[Mitchs98]

Ehhh..No. Just, no. This would be a nerf to generally, well, everything really. Antags, security, mining, engineering, cargo, botany, science...you get the point. No one needs slow downs for pulling objects, much less for pulling people. Rollerbeds aren't always around and all it would take would be for Antag McJackass or a random greytider to bin the rollerbeds and medical would be fucked.
 

We don't really need much realism in SS13, trying to turn it into a real life simulator is basically straying from the games purpose. Am I saying to make it entirely unrealistic? No. Am I saying not to add pointless things geared towards making everyones' day harder? Yes, yes I am. Unneeded and would generally just kill the game. Using Goon that already has a faster run and walk speed as an example doesn't entirely count here.

[Starker]

I agree. There should be a heavy reduction in speed when dragging someone. This would force people to use roller beds as intended.

[Kryson]

On 6/28/2017 at 2:05 PM, ZN23X said:

[...]If this was employed I'd powergame[...]

The absolute state of paradise admins.

I agree that slowing you down to walking speed is excessive but some slow down would really help both immersion and gameplay.

If an armed madman is murdering your coworker you should not be able to carry them away at lightning speed.

[ZN23X]

52 minutes ago, Kryson said:

The absolute state of paradise admins.

I agree that slowing you down to walking speed is excessive but some slow down would really help both immersion and gameplay.

If an armed madman is murdering your coworker you should not be able to carry them away at lightning speed.

Out of context without the full quote and necropost quoting something I said 6 over months before being an admin XD

But I still stand by it would be miserable to have to cuff someone in sci maint and drag them to the brig. If you dont think so, literally just go to the far corner of sci maint then walk to the brig. And then do it a few dozen times. After you are done doing that let me know if you think this would still help immersion and enhance gameplay or if you think it just makes things miserable and slow. I only pointed out the wheelchair/rollerbed thing cuz there are absolutely players who WOULD do this, cuz they cant help themselves. I wouldnt actually do it. I'd just use adminbus and teleport us 

This would just create another advantage for the try hards because they are the only ones who would go through whatever is needed to get around this.

Edited November 8, 2018 by ZN23X

[Fox McCloud]

This is going to be horrendous for security to deal with.

If there's multiple assailants, then keeping them down and being able to get away in time is going to be very very difficult.

 

Likewise, it's going to lead to a lot of situations where stun-cuff-dragging someone off is just going to result in said person getting caught.

 

Also effectively kills off blocking of projectiles tactically---and uh, mining would be even more slow until you got the bluespace satchel.

[TyOmaha]

20 minutes ago, Fox McCloud said:

This is going to be horrendous for security to deal with.

Thats why we add squad cars 

Edited November 8, 2018 by Ty Omaha

[Fursamie]

On 11/9/2018 at 2:24 AM, Fox McCloud said:

This is going to be horrendous for security to deal with.

If there's multiple assailants, then keeping them down and being able to get away in time is going to be very very difficult.

Emphasis on multiple assailants, security officers (even the best) are not genetically reproduced James Bonds. Odds are, you get into a fight with more than one people, you lose! This is a server that encourages players & admins to "break the meta" and "RP to a basic level", innit? So it seems to me that it'd only be fair for a MRP server to accept the fact Jenkins O' Baton can't single handedly fight off a group of 5 assistants with a taser and some handcuffs.

 

On 11/9/2018 at 2:24 AM, Fox McCloud said:

Likewise, it's going to lead to a lot of situations where stun-cuff-dragging someone off is just going to result in said person getting caught.

Assuming the "person" getting caught is the stun-cuffer, well.. You see, people weigh a lot. The average person does anyways. Trying to quite literally STEAL somebody as if they weigh 10 pounds and dash away is unrealistic and is unfun for literally anyone involved beside the stun cuffer. Anyone trying to pursue should logically get on their tail rather quickly, but will usually be outrunned either because they give up, fall for a trap, or get stuck behind some sort of obstacle, and the person being stun cuffed will probably not get rescued because of the above reasons.

 

On 11/9/2018 at 2:24 AM, Fox McCloud said:

Also effectively kills off blocking of projectiles tactically---and uh, mining would be even more slow until you got the bluespace satchel.

For the projectile statement, I will assume you mean using someone as a shield - shields have a sort of strap for where your arm would go to help better fit and protect your body. Amazingly, humans do not have this feature. Holding someone in a choke hold would result in your arm being a potential target, not to mention the meatshield's feet getting in the way if you plan to be mobile. Same with holding by the shirt, however your arms would not be a target or alternatively if held by their hands if they're in cuffs. It just isn't a smart move to make, as is the reason this only is used (albeit rarely) for hostage situations.

To add, it's already a miracle that a pickaxe (which apparently is on the same caliber with the kinetic gun) can take down mounds of rock in mere seconds - pulling all that rock and mineral would be unbelievably difficult, it would make sense IC and would be a fair nerf to the miners who bring 2 or more crates/ore boxes to mining. 

[The Respected Man]

My thread got forcefed a strange reagent pill and brought back to life, e p i c. 

Getting good memories of this thread.

After this suggestion sunk into obscurity a conga pull line meta materialized and it had to be broken up with seraph mechs and other forms of admin-grief. That was hilarious. 

I suggest you all save your time by not making another post here again, this suggestion is dead and will never be implemented. 

cya

[JovanM]

Why not expand this thread to dragging mechanics?

On some (nukeops) rounds I have seen as some kitten was dragging around an unconscious fully armored security. That was really weird. I suppose that current game mechanics makes it possible even for a butterfly to drag heavy stuff behind!

 

On some servers I have seen that a character needs one free hand to start dragging.

[tigercat2000]

Don't necropost. This thread was dead as of over a year before someone decided to revive it. If it's seriously something to consider... make a new thread, which can be talked about with a current opinion.