ZN23X Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) Not a complaint towards a particular admin, morso a process controlled by admins. Referencing https://nanotrasen.se/forum/topic/11172-admin-action-complaint-alffd/?tab=comments#comment-92539. Why are all the non admins who aren't involved in this being allowed to comment here? I've commented on admin complaints where I've been told I'm not part of the situation so I'm not allowed to comment. I've been told to stop, gotten a formal warning, and had my posts deleted. Wierd part too is, most of my responses to the complaints were defending the admins. Feels like if people are allowed to comment as long as they oppose the admins and are willing to be volatile and loud about it. Is that the atmosphere we want to promote? I don't get it. Edited August 6, 2017 by ZN23X 1 Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regen Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 The reference you're linking to isn't really an admin complaint, nor is this. Generally I try to be careful with removing people's posts in admin complaints, because I don't want it to look like we censor what we don't like. However you're right in the fact that if you're not involved you shouldn't be posting. 20 minutes ago, ZN23X said: Wierd part too is, most of my responses to the complaints were defending the admins. Feels like if people are allowed to comment as long as they oppose the admins and are willing to be volatile and loud about it. Is that the atmosphere we want to promote? I don't get it. A big part of the complaint for us is remaining objective, doesn't really matter if you're "defending" the admins. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92546 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biabri Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) The thread you made show that people know about the situation and oppose the wrongful decision. The fact that you're supporting the admins doesn't mean you're right and it doesn't mean that you are allowed to be volatile and be just frankly rude and disrespectful to someone who may have a valid complaint. If an issue is about an admin then it helps to have people are opposing them and giving more information on the subject, rather than comments made in ignorance of the situation saying "Admin-kun isn't like that." or "I'm sure you're in the wrong, admins never make mistakes." Which is what the admin complaints forum is about. If you have nothing to contribute apart from your own biased views, maybe don't comment? This is the admin complaints section, not the admin coddle camp. Regen DID tell her off.. Edited August 6, 2017 by Biabri Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92547 Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 In general, people shouldn't be posting on it at all. 99% of admin complaints require only the person posting and an admin replying. What we really want to avoid is people pitching in with their thoughts, feelings, opinions, etc. If everyone who has one of those posts, it'll be a clusterfuck in no time at all. If we want to collect peoples opinions or feelings about something, we'll do so. The forum there is for an investigation into an incident, not gauging how people feel about it. If you have some evidence, however, such as logs, showing something new or something contrary to what another has said, then we'll need input. It's generally best to contact one of the admins dealing with it however, as they will general have a lot more knowledge to know how relevant it is (like, the actual logs), etc. Tl;dr - commenting on admin complaints should be an anomaly because you happened to be directly involved, not a peanut gallery Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZN23X Posted August 6, 2017 Author Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) @Biabri my responses weren't just me saying "stop picking on admins" in previous complaints, they were actually me explaining a similar or identical situation I had been in and how I didn't have the same angry perspective the complainer did when I was put in the same spot. This isn't just a place to stomp admins into the ground. It's to discuss and resolve issues people have had with admins, which sometimes involves material that supports the admin. ...and if I were to write a response like you did here I would be told to stop, be warned, and posts deleted. Everyone's bias in some way or another. So you are essentially saying nobody should comment on anything ever unless they are completely neutral. Someone agreeing with you doesn't make them unbias, it makes them share the same bias you do. Edited August 6, 2017 by ZN23X Doppler radar detects a shitstorm forming... Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92550 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZN23X Posted August 6, 2017 Author Posted August 6, 2017 Also @Regen if I mention the names of the admins who have given me warnings and deleted my posts in the past does that make this an official complaint? And if so, will players w̶h̶o̶ ̶h̶a̶v̶e̶ ̶b̶e̶e̶n̶ ̶b̶a̶n̶n̶e̶d̶ ̶f̶r̶o̶m̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶ ̶s̶e̶r̶v̶e̶r̶ ̶w̶h̶o̶ ̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶t̶r̶o̶l̶l̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶m̶y̶ ̶p̶o̶s̶t̶s̶ ̶b̶e̶c̶a̶u̶s̶e̶ ̶t̶h̶e̶y̶ ̶d̶o̶n̶'̶t̶ ̶l̶i̶k̶e̶ ̶m̶e̶ ̶ also be warned and have thier posts deleted? Or should I be allowed to give me peice in complaints moving forward, my warning removed, and the admins be forced to kneel down before me and apologize profusely for daring to be human and make a mistake? Still kind of confused here. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92555 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biabri Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) If you can't be objective or provide relevant information you have no right to be in the conversation and are just being disruptive. I don't need to 'troll' your posts. If you put something in a public space and invite input then I'll provide input. You were the one that was openly hostile to me because you were taking the sides of admins without any knowledge, even after i pointed out some discprepencies... You've made a point, I've made mine. This is nothing to do with you personally and I would have made the same comments I have made. Or should I be allowed to give me peice in complaints moving forward, my warning removed, and the admins be forced to kneel down before me and apologize profusely for daring to be human and make a mistake? Still kind of confused here. Ahahahaahahahaha. If only you understood the irony here. As far as I'm aware, this is the policy for players when dealing with them. Or get banned. *Points to self* If people get gratification because an admin has to apologise to them for an exchange for genuine fuck ups that can ruin rounds or mistakes in judgements that lead to unjust or too harsh punishments then let them... Edited August 6, 2017 by Biabri Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92558 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 Let's not start a flamewar, please. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92560 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Biabri Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 No intention of doing so, there's no hostility from me here but I've clearly brushed off against ZN23X in the wrong way. I'm not entirely sure why, maybe it's just their prejudice against people who have upset the precious admin overlords. I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but I clearly don't have the same level of intense piety that they do when it comes to you 'human volunteers who make mistakes just like anyone else and have lives too' so... Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92561 Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 6 minutes ago, Biabri said: , maybe it's just their prejudice against people who have upset the precious admin overlords. That's not the way you go about talking to people. 6 minutes ago, Biabri said: I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but I clearly don't have the same level of intense piety that they do when it comes to you 'human volunteers who make mistakes just like anyone else and have lives too' so... Yeah. You very much are trying to be disrespectful. 1 Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92562 Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeadBySmiley Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) Why is this in admin complaint ? Why isnt this in general discussion where disscussion about things is supposed to be held ? I noticed a lot of people really like to put the most retarded things in admin complaints which really should be in general discussion. Even the John Ooze really shouldnt be in Admin Complaints. But that one makes at least some sense since in general disscusion it would be kinda weird since its really not general but i think there should be a category thats just named Debates for this kind of thing. You know so people can debate about specific things being good or bad. Edited August 6, 2017 by DeadBySmiley Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92568 Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexpkeaton Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 I do think @ZN23X makes a fair point about admins taking a heavier hand against people in admin complaints who write in support of admins. As Regens said, admins are very careful not to appear to be censoring content. So it is a lot easier to come down more harshly against those who have already demonstrated that they are on the admins' side. And a lot easier to remove those posts. And that just isn't fair. Have one standard and apply it universally. Personally, I do not think any post in this section should be deleted unless it is obscene, threatening or harrassing. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92570 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZN23X Posted August 6, 2017 Author Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) It is actually an admin complaint based on inconsistency in treatment of different people. Just the fact that people who are non admins have been allowed to chime in like I've been disallowed to in the past is making it turn into a general discussion, which is reinforcing my initial complaint, and reinforcing why the admins don't allow extra commentary in this section. Cuz it makes it a mess of shit. But if the admins dared silence the people who oppose them they'd be in even deeper shit because all those people will then file thier own complaints about how they were silenced. This will probably get locked soon to prevent more shit (which I would be fine with. Fairly positive I've made my point). Edited August 6, 2017 by ZN23X Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92572 Share on other sites More sharing options...
McRamon Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 (edited) Public conversation section for ban appeals and admin complaints when? Sometimes reading them i really want to say something or made up a joke about subject, but i understand it wont be appreciated due to distraction it may cause, but you know, sometimes it is really like coliseum, and i wish i could talk to others about the show))) anyway, rightnow better not to comment in complaints or appeals at all if you are not involved. You may seem to yourself superobjective but ... Edited August 6, 2017 by McRamon Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92574 Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted August 6, 2017 Posted August 6, 2017 13 minutes ago, McRamon said: Public conversation section for ban appeals and admin complaints when? Sometimes reading them i really want to say something or made up a joke about subject, but i understand it wont be appreciated due to distraction it may cause, but you know, sometimes it is really like coliseum, and i wish i could talk about others about show))) anyway, rightnow better not to comment in complaints or appeals at all if you are not involved. You may seem to yourself superobjective but ... While I'd love to allow that, and you know....make such comments and jokes myself to my friends privately, I reaaallly don't want to encourage public mocking and generally being an asshole to people. Yes. Even those people in those ban appeals. Have some shame and giggle at them behind closed doors. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92575 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZN23X Posted August 7, 2017 Author Posted August 7, 2017 (edited) Still have alot of non admin comments here with no repercussions. If it was dealt with after the first post then this wouldn't have escalated further. Edited August 7, 2017 by ZN23X Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92628 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Regen Posted August 7, 2017 Posted August 7, 2017 9 hours ago, ZN23X said: Still have alot of non admin comments here with no repercussions. If it was dealt with after the first post then this wouldn't have escalated further. You have no idea if there's been any reprecussions, because you don't see if we warn and or ban anyone, stop assuming that nothing has been done. I'm going to close this thread, there's nothing else to get out of it. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/11176-whos-allowed-to-talk-in-admin-complaints/#findComment-92648 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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