Creating a second AI

[EvadableMoxie]

2 hours ago, Dinarzad said:

Or you can just respond to valid ways of handling the problem you're having with reaction images.
That also will totally help solve your problem and will, in no way, be any sort of detriment.

Laughter seemed the more appropriate response to the assertion that if you should bring a problem to the IAA after the Captain fails to solve it. What you said was not a valid way to handle my problem. It was something so completely absurd that I'm actually shocked you typed it. 

The condescension is much more predictable, but not worthy of response. I suppose we'll just agree to disagree. It's getting more heated than I really intended.  I wanted this to be a discussion about what people think rather than simply trying to assert a specific position, so thank you for taking the time to give your opinion.

Edited January 11, 2018 by EvadableMoxie

[Shadeykins]

4 minutes ago, EvadableMoxie said:

Laughter seemed the more appropriate response to the assertion that if you should bring a problem to the IAA after the Captain fails to solve it. What you said was not a valid way to handle my problem. It was something so completely absurd that I'm actually shocked you typed it. 

The condescension is much more predictable, but not worthy of response. I suppose we'll just agree to disagree. It's getting more heated than I really intended.  I wanted this to be a discussion about what people think rather than simply trying to assert a specific position, so thank you for taking the time to give your opinion.

If the Captain fails to resolve an issue, bringing it to an IAA is the actual resolution to that.

That's why the IAA's can fax Central Command and get awful command members shitcanned, whereas say, the Chief Engineer can't.

In fact, it happens on a relatively frequent basis. The lion's share of head-level demotions issued out are because an IAA/Rep alerts CC to an issue.

[EvadableMoxie]

Okay, since this is beside the point I'll just move on. Let's just say I go to the IA and the person who made the second AI gets demoted.

That's punishment. I don't really care about that. I care about prevention.

I'm not going to spend half a round fighting with command and security and the IA to demote someone for making a second AI. As soon as I start doing that my round is now ruined.  It isn't fun to be doing that, it isn't fun to spend your round yelling at command and security and trying to chase down IA to do something.  That isn't fun.  And even when successful getting the person who made the second AI demoted doesn't get rid of the second AI.  It doesn't give me back the time I've lost dealing with it.  It doesn't fix my problem or make the round fun again.

Edited January 11, 2018 by EvadableMoxie

[Dinarzad]

28 minutes ago, EvadableMoxie said:

Okay, since this is beside the point I'll just move on. Let's just say I go to the IA and the person who made the second AI gets demoted.

That's punishment. I don't really care about that. I care about prevention.

I'm not going to spend half a round fighting with command and security and the IA to demote someone for making a second AI. As soon as I start doing that my round is now ruined.  It isn't fun to be doing that, it isn't fun to spend your round yelling at command and security and trying to chase down IA to do something.  That isn't fun.  And even when successful getting the person who made the second AI demoted doesn't get rid of the second AI.  It doesn't give me back the time I've lost dealing with it.  It doesn't fix my problem or make the round fun again.

Sorry to say but you've gotta just deal with it on this issue.

Your preferences do not dictate what other people can and can't do. I deal with other people who do stuff I hate all the time, things that make the round obnoxious on me, I fuckin' loathe vomit grenades or blood grenades, especially as a janitor. You know how often people make that stuff? How often I've been working a job to have someone else suddenly show up cuz they went to the HoP? If that's what the round is, then that's just what it is. Someone else wanted to play AI, they found someone willing to make them an AI, found the RD willing to approve it and a Captain willing to sign off on it. It's ICly all legit. If it isn't legit then you have methods to handle that in-game.
They went through about 4-5 other people to do the thing they wanted to do, you can too. Your fun does not take precedence over theirs, not when you have viable IC means of handling it all.  I understand WHY it throws you off and am sorry to hear that you feel it ruined your round, but that's just not a reason to enforce it with a rule.

You are playing an AI. A machine. You don't get a say in it and are not asked about it because you are a trillion dollar laptop to the crew. You do not have rights as an AI, you have laws that you follow. That's the curse of playing a synthetic, you basically don't get a say in anything. You can suggest and handle things after the fact. You gotta take the good with the bad, especially with something as uncommon as multiple AI. I can go months at a time without seeing a round with more then 1 AI functioning at the same time.

[Jountax]

1 hour ago, EvadableMoxie said:

Okay, since this is beside the point I'll just move on. Let's just say I go to the IA and the person who made the second AI gets demoted.

That's punishment. I don't really care about that. I care about prevention.

I'm not going to spend half a round fighting with command and security and the IA to demote someone for making a second AI. As soon as I start doing that my round is now ruined.  It isn't fun to be doing that, it isn't fun to spend your round yelling at command and security and trying to chase down IA to do something.  That isn't fun.  And even when successful getting the person who made the second AI demoted doesn't get rid of the second AI.  It doesn't give me back the time I've lost dealing with it.  It doesn't fix my problem or make the round fun again.

I for one, would find working with an AI to get the captain who approved a second AI for no reason demoted to be an immensely fun RP experience were I working as an IAA/Rep. I'm sorry to hear you wouldn't feel the same.

As for rectifying the situation, the second AI can always be carded, or given laws to essentially make it a slightly more ethereal borg slaved to you (thus making all borgs slaved to it slaved to you as well). They can also be given laws that forbid them from being 'outside' of an exosuit for any period of time unless none exist that they can pilot, and of course, they can be simply terminated while a few posibrains are 'conveniently' being created and activated simultaneously.

If they don't end up in one of the brains, then oh well. Becoming an AI, in most cases, means they actively sought it out or were a freshly activated posibrain anyway. The random civilian who happens to be the target of a tator has much less input on why they're being removed from the round.

Edited January 11, 2018 by Jountax

[tiredbum]

Speaking as someone who made a second AI 2 or 3 times as a simple grey tiding assistant, there was nothing stopping me from making an AI other then a few walls and unhelpful robotists. This was prior to the IAA change though, so at the time there was nothing that an almost always SSD IAA could have done to stop me. The last time I did it though, a chrono soldier did show up, I took that as a sign to stop doing it

[TrainTN]

2 hours ago, tiredbum said:

Speaking as someone who made a second AI 2 or 3 times as a simple grey tiding assistant, there was nothing stopping me from making an AI other then a few walls and unhelpful robotists. This was prior to the IAA change though, so at the time there was nothing that an almost always SSD IAA could have done to stop me. The last time I did it though, a chrono soldier did show up, I took that as a sign to stop doing it

Even currently, the only thing IA could do is tell Security to arrest you. That would require them somehow finding out about it before Security does. I have arrested quasi-greytiders for trying to build AIs without authorization and they did try to argue it wasn't against Space Law or SoP even though it absolutely is.

It feels like when I play a round and something happens that actually makes me want to talk to IA, they're never around. Clown robbed my very important shit, I want to file a complaint, no IAA. Security silently tased me and dragged me into the brig and stripped me naked over nothing, no IA. Someone keeps poisoning all the food or there is no food, no IA.

The real trouble of IA is that there's little reason to go to them instead of a head of staff. The IAA will just end up going to that head of staff themselves. I suppose the idea is that you unload your problem on them and they take care of it while you get back to work but most people will find it faster and more expedient to just do it themselves.

[Jountax]

I hope the recent change to IAAs will make them able to be more proactive at this sort of thing, so they don't need to just sit in their office and wait for a crewmember to have a complaint.

[SomanB]

There's also the meta aspect to consider here. A rounstart AI has a chance to be traitor. A built AI does not.

 

We already have command and sec players who openly state "If the AI isn't doing as I ask, I watch it via cameras."

It's not much of a stretch for a validhunt RD/Command to build second AIs "just in case"