Admin Complain: Alfffd

[kainoa1000]

Admin(s) Key: Alffd
Your ckey (Byond username): Kainoa

Date(s) of incident (GMT preferred): 8:29 AM Monday, February 18, 2019Nature of complaint:
misuse of power.

Brief description (tl;dr here. Just the critical elements):

He was angry that I was greytiding using a cleaner of space lube and a water sprayer (this was an on and off thing across 2 rounds.). He decided to spawn himself in as a god with no slips and then chase me down and beat me to death with a toolbox while taunting me in IC chat saying "you seem to have some difficulty breathing".   During this time no admin said anything to me.

Afterwards I ahelped that someone had murderboned me. Alffd told me that he had spawned himself in and killed me because I had been greytiding. We talked in ahelp for about 35 minutes or so. I don't know how to get everything we both said and put it in a pastebin so I'm going to copypaste the things that are important and put them below. After we talked he started shittalking me and telling me that I was banned from TG and that I was arguing with the admins. 

 

Full description of events: Here is a log of the chat we had from somewhere around 25 minutes in to the conversation to the end. This does a really good job of completely explaining what happened

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: What I am saying is this. You did the same thing, in two rounds. It seems very clear the reason in both was because you wanted to dick around.

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: You are now complaning that an admin dicked around with you after it became apparent that was your goal.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: But that doesn't seem like it makes it justified for you to just randomly spawn yourself in and beat me to death.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: The difference between you and me is that I never took anyone out of the round or killed someone.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: Actually what you're saying is that you thought it would be fun to just kill me?

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: You ended up dying in medbay, where you were revived.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: you KILLED me in medbay. You walked over to me, and then beat me to death in medbay. Sayuing I "ended up dying in medbay" is a rediculous way of understating your misuse of power

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I tried to run away and you ignored me

Adminhelp to-Alffd: In fact I didn't even fight back. I tried slipping and I tried disarming and I did both of those things while running away from you. I literally didn't deal a single point of damage and when you beat me into crit and broke my ribs I ran to a sec officer and tried to communicate to them what was going on using IC and you didn't care, you just chased me down with a toolbox and killed me without saying anything using your admin PMs and didn't explain anything to me

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I broke bones? who's bones did I break?

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: The round before. Slipping into walls when lube is used, results in broken bones fairly often.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: And again, if I dont break any rules then you don't have any right at all to interfere. If I do break rules, you should either give an appropriate warning or an appropriate ban and communicate to me what I did wrong. If you think I was greifing too hard then you should explicitly say "You were greifing too hard" and then take appropriate action. What you did was a gross missuse of power, and If I didn't come to you in ahelps an entire round after it happened then I would have never even KNOWN that the guy who killed me was an admin spawn. I thought it was a guy in no slips who murderboned me as antag at first ,then I thought it was a guy selfantaging who found a pair of noslips and thought it would be funny to kil me randomly.

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: You absolutly have a point.

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: Let me try to explain what is happening here.

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: You got banned on TG. it would have been an easy ban to get appealed, but you really like going at it with admins.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I think I understand. It's fine I guess it wasn't a huge deal. If I broke rules and took things too far I'll just take this as a warning and decide not to do it again

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I didn't get banned on tg. want me to go log in right now and proove it?

Adminhelp from-Server HostAlffd: No thats fine. I just searched and you are not banned.

Adminhelp to-Alffd: idk dude

Adminhelp to-Alffd: whatever's fine

(This is the end of the entire conversation)

 

Here's if I took greytiding too far, I understand. A temp ban or a warning with an accompanying admin remark is understandable. I can see how I took things too far. The problem is that nobody DID that. What the Alffd did was ruin my round without telling me why he did that and without explaining to me what happened. I think he just decided it would be fun to spawn himself in as a god and then beat me to death, and it seems like he just picked me as a scapegoat because I was already slipping people. 

 

Edited February 18, 2019 by kainoa1000

[kainoa1000]

So when I started writing this complaint, it was 1:39. about 30 minutes later he suddenly gave me a permaban with this accompanying message: 

 

I just want to make it clear that I wrote the entirety of this post and then uploaded it to the forums before Alffd decided to go to tgstation discord, ask them about information about me, and then permaban me from paradise based on what the admins on tgstation said about me. The ban and this complaint are completely unrelated.

I don't want this complaint to come off as some sort of rage-fueled rant about Alffd in response to a permaban.

Edited February 18, 2019 by kainoa1000

[kainoa1000]

I'm like actually dumbfounded at what happened though. 

He spawned himself in to murderbone me for fun. Then he started trashtalking me about getting banned from tg despite never getting banned from tg. And then at the end he went to tg, and started asking the mods for dirt on me and dug shit up about a ban from a week ago and then just perma'd me for it without saying a word. Who does that? Why did he do that?

Edited February 18, 2019 by kainoa1000

[kainoa1000]

I'd like to make a follow up again, (sorry if it's annoying that I keep making comments under my initial complaint.)

If an admin could give me a hand and help me get a set of the logs where Alffd and I had a conversation I would really appreciate it. I think I missed one of the messages he sent while I was trying to copypaste during the time it took me to write the post.

if i recall correctly, between one of these three messages he said something to me which I missed when I was copypasting and there's a good chance I might've missed more:

 

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I tried to run away and you ignored me

Adminhelp to-Alffd: In fact I didn't even fight back. I tried slipping and I tried disarming and I did both of those things while running away from you. I literally didn't deal a single point of damage and when you beat me into crit and broke my ribs I ran to a sec officer and tried to communicate to them what was going on using IC and you didn't care, you just chased me down with a toolbox and killed me without saying anything using your admin PMs and didn't explain anything to me

Adminhelp to-Alffd: I broke bones? who's bones did I break?

[Spacemanspark]

Quote

[2019-02-18T08:31] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Alffd)->Kainoa/(Kainoa): Who were you last round?

[2019-02-18T08:48] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Kainoa)->Alffd/(Alffd): Toth Borger. I think the guy who killed me was nathanial? I can't remember because he was unknown and only spoke once

[2019-02-18T08:27] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Alffd)->Kainoa/(Kainoa): So, whats the deal with all the graytiding?

[2019-02-18T08:01] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Kainoa)->Alffd/(Poly): I was kinda just following the clown's lead. Are you talking about when I jumped the table into the kitchen?

[2019-02-18T08:23] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): With the lube sprayer? Because you were doing that the round before also.

[2019-02-18T08] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): It wasn't lube, it was water. Also I just sort of found it and started slipping people with it. If I took it too far I totally understand. Last round was different though, completely completely different. Sec had brigged me for 10 minutes and refused to say what I did, then after my 10 minutes were up I spent another 10 minutes waiting in the brig for someone to let me out, and nobody did, so I started slipping officers.
    
[2019-02-18T08:50] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): OK, because from our perspective, you are super new to the server, but know a ton about the game.

[2019-02-18T08:08] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): So you are either a transplant from another server, or something else is going on.

[2019-02-18T08:18] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): http://www.byond.com/members/Kainoa Joined: Jun 20 2013

[2019-02-18T08:32] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Cool, transplant then.

[2019-02-18T08:02] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Anyways, yeah thats why you got beaten into crit by a graytide.

[2019-02-18T08] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I wanted to try high roleplay but people don't really roleplay. The last few rounds people have just chased me down trying to push me over and take my shit, and the sec officers just arrest me and then brig me for 10 minutes without saying a single word.
    
[2019-02-18T08:24] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Yeah, we are... not HRP.

[2019-02-18T08:26] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): wait what? I literally got beaten to death for slipping people?

[2019-02-18T08:52] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Over the course of a two rounds? Yeah. Although you were not supposed to die.

[2019-02-18T08:16] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Wait what? were you the one who killed me?

[2019-02-18T08:16:19] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Yep.

[2019-02-18T08:16:39] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Ok. Why are you dealing with my ticket? You literally just admitted to metagaming too.

[2019-02-18T08:17] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): It was not meta, as the only they existed was for that.

[2019-02-18T08:17:28] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I dont understand can you explain again

[2019-02-18T08:17:54] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Sure, whatever that name was, I also don't remember, as it was made with admin tools and was a random name.

[2019-02-18T08:18] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): You spawned in just to beat me to death and then quit?

[2019-02-18T08:18:49] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): I stuck around, but before the round started, a few of us talked over the level of tide, and your name came up as a concern. So you were under observation.

[2019-02-18T08:18:53] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Also can a different admin handle my request? I feel like maybe you're a little biased consider you literally killed me

[2019-02-18T08:19:02] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Sure,

[2019-02-18T08:19:33] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): You know, if you feel like I take something too far there's a much fucking easier way of dealing with things

[2019-02-18T08:19:38] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): JUST FUCKING SAY SOMETHING

[2019-02-18T08:19:58] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Literally "bwoink tone it down" and you're done. instead you spawned yourself into the round and beat me to death for fun

[2019-02-18T08:20:29] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): That is always an option. Waiting for someone else to take this ticket.

[2019-02-18T08:21:08] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): dude I just want to know I'm actually seething mad

[2019-02-18T08:21:28] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Know what?

[2019-02-18T08:21:30] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): like if this is normal admin behavior then I'm shocked

[2019-02-18T08:22] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I just feel bad dude

[2019-02-18T08:22:30] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): I woulden't say its normal. But look at it from this vantage point. You spend two rounds going out of your way to harass other players.

[2019-02-18T08:22:53] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Now you feel like your round was messed with, and you are upset.

[2019-02-18T08:23:07] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Which is totally fine, thats a feeling I understand.

[2019-02-18T08:23] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): who was I harrassing the first round?

[2019-02-18T08:23:27] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You didin't spray down all of security, then randomly spary sections of the station?

[2019-02-18T08:23:53] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): If they wanted me to exit security, they should have opened the door to security so I can leave. Instead I spent 20 minutes stuck in the brig because none of them would let me out.

[2019-02-18T08:23:56] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Perhaps not all, just the lobby and hallway.

[2019-02-18T08:24] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): So, you sprayed everything down.

[2019-02-18T08:24:20] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): The round after, what did the chef do to you?

[2019-02-18T08:24:52] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): nothing. That's why I didn't deal a single point of damage to him and didn't threaten him in any way. I dicked around following the clown's lead, and then left afterwards and didn't even talk to him once again the rest of the game
    
[2019-02-18T08:25:21] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): OK, so what about the other dicking around in the round after?

[2019-02-18T08:25:30] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Whhy were you in the brig to begin with?

[2019-02-18T08:26:20] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I dont know. I asked the hos and he refused to say even a single word to me. When he arrested me, he had to ask over comms why I was set to arrest and never told me anything. I opened an admin ticket abnout it and never got a responsee, 30 or so mintues later the ticket was closed with no response from the admins and I just assumed whatever happened was an IC issue.
    
[2019-02-18T08:27:06] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Once again let me clarify. The HOS tazed me without saying anything out of the blue. Did not say why he was tazing me. He dragged me to brig and put me in a cell for 10 minutes.. Did not tell me why I was being put in the cell.

[2019-02-18T08:28:05] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You were spraying down security on red, when they were obviously stressed and things were falling into chaos. Then the next round, you go dicking around with people. You did not ahelp anything with security. Even if that was all justified, the next round you immediatly start the same behavior that you are trying to justify from the previous round by blaming security.
    
[2019-02-18T08:28:17] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): That happened after.

[2019-02-18T08:28:23] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): >You were spraying down security on red, when they were obviously stressed and things were falling into chaos.

[2019-02-18T08:28:38] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Yes, I am not talking about why they locked you up.

[2019-02-18T08:28:48] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): What are you tralking about then?

[2019-02-18T08:29] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): >You did not ahelp anything with security yeah I did. I literally made an ahelp as soon as it happened. I never got a ticket back.

[2019-02-18T08:30:46] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): I am saying, that unless the chef locked you in the freezer for ten minutes. You can't claim it was justified in the second case. So there are two different cases of you acting in a graytide manner, doing the exact same thing. But in the first, it was the fault of security, and in the second, it was because you were dicking around. To me, it seems clear in both cases you were dicking around. The security thing really just seems to be an excuse, but you were likley to have done it regardless. Because the next round, you did do it again.

[2019-02-18T08:31:35] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I don't want to get banned for admin disrespect so I'm really sorry if this comes off the wrong way but I'm having a lot of trouble understanding all the messages you're sending

[2019-02-18T08:31:53] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): That does not come close to getting you banned, don't worry.

[2019-02-18T08:32:18] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): So what you're saying is that you spawned yourself in and beat me to death because you decided that I was slipping too many people?

[2019-02-18T08:32:23] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): What I am saying is this. You did the same thing, in two rounds. It seems very clear the reason in both was because you wanted to dick around.

[2019-02-18T08:33:00] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You are now complaning that an admin dicked around with you after it became apparent that was your goal.

[2019-02-18T08:33:05] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): But that doesn't seem like it makes it justified for you to just randomly spawn yourself in and beat me to death.

[2019-02-18T08:33:25] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): The difference between you and me is that I never took anyone out of the round or killed someone.

[2019-02-18T08:33:42] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): Actually what you're saying is that you thought it would be fun to just kill me?

[2019-02-18T08:33:53] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You ended up dying in medbay, where you were revived.
    
[2019-02-18T08:34:24] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): you KILLED me in medbay. You walked over to me, and then beat me to death in medbay. Sayuing I "ended up dying in medbay" is a rediculous way of understating your misuse of power

[2019-02-18T08:34:38] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I tried to run away and you ignored me
    
[2019-02-18T08:35:42] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): OK look. In your two rounds here, you essentially just ran around griefing people. Not killing anyone, but breaking some bones, and being a dick.

[2019-02-18T08:35:51] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): In fact I didn't even fight back. I tried slipping and I tried disarming and I did both of those things while running away from you. I literally didn't deal a single point of damage and when you beat me into crit and broke my ribs I ran to a sec officer and tried to communicate to them what was going on using IC and you didn't care, you just chased me down with a toolbox and killed me without saying anything using your admin PMs and didn't explain anything to me

[2019-02-18T08:36:02] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I broke bones? who's bones did I break?

[2019-02-18T08:36:28] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): The round before. Slipping into walls when lube is used, results in broken bones fairly often.

[2019-02-18T08:37:55] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): And again, if I dont break any rules then you don't have any right at all to interfere. If I do break rules, you should either give an appropriate warning or an appropriate ban and communicate to me what I did wrong. If you think I was greifing too hard then you should explicitly say "You were greifing too hard" and then take appropriate action. What you did was a gross missuse of power, and If I didn't come to you in ahelps an entire round after it happened then I would have never even KNOWN that the guy who killed me was an admin spawn. I thought it was a guy in no slips who murderboned me as antag at first ,then I thought it was a guy selfantaging who found a pair of noslips and thought it would be funny to kil me randomly.

[2019-02-18T08:38:50] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You absolutly have a point.

[2019-02-18T08:40] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): Let me try to explain what is happening here.
    
[2019-02-18T08:40:49] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): You got banned on TG. it would have been an easy ban to get appealed, but you really like going at it with admins.

[2019-02-18T08:41:01] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I think I understand. It's fine I guess it wasn't a huge deal. If I broke rules and took things too far I'll just take this as a warning and decide not to do it again

[2019-02-18T08:41:16] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): I didn't get banned on tg. want me to go log in right now and proove it?

[2019-02-18T08:42:04] ADMIN: PM: Alffd/(Poly)->Kainoa/(Toth Borger): No thats fine. I just searched and you are not banned.

[2019-02-18T08:42:34] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): idk dude

[2019-02-18T08:42:42] ADMIN: PM: Kainoa/(Toth Borger)->Alffd/(Poly): whatever's fine

 

[necaladun]

Hi there,

Thank you for this complaint. Apologies for the delays. IRL sucks, and I didn't see this as a pressing matter.

Thanks @Spacemanspark for helping with the logs there.

When it comes to greytiding, admins are allowed to deal with it in an IC manner - that includes an antag targeting the greytider. In this case, it appears Alffd spawned as a greytider antag, with you as a target. Other methods of dealing with things like this we've used include sudden brain damage, appendicitis, kingstons, and other diseases. 

From perusing the logs, it appears you were then robusted with a toolbox - a classic greytider move. 

Admins are allowed and encouraged to create situations like this that are generally more fun for the crew as a whole than a bwoink and tempban. This is much less of a "punishment" than either of those, and generally mercy such as that is at admin discretion. Combining mercy like that with an IC situation is generally preferred. If being beaten to death once and then revived in medbay "ruins" your round, then this likely isn't a good game for you - as death can occur quite regularly. 

Admin's are trusted with discretion of how to deal with the playerbase in IC or OOC manners for the most part, and given your conduct among the SS13 community, it seems the right call was made here with the response to greytiding and then the eventual ban. 

As there's no misconduct here, I consider this resolved.