Nerf Goliaths

[MrMagolor]

As Denthamos has pointed out in discord, the goliaths are definitely built around being fought with tg's movespeed.

Their tendrils trigger extremely quickly and also stun for a long time.

And, since their attacks are so strong, it is a GUARANTEED bone break- which makes it even less likely to escape them, ensuring a swift death.

What this is doing is effectively punishing the player for making a SINGLE mistake, which is ridiculous.

Doubling the "trigger time" on the tendrils would frankly be enough to satisfy me, as well as perhaps increasing the timer for goliath movement.

[MarsMond]

Goliaths are only strong enough for guaranteed bone breaks on hands and feet, if they are unarmored. Unfortunatly, said appendages ARE unarmored with the normal explorer suit.

I'm don't think this is necessarily intended, and as far as i know, TG has the whoole body covered, since they lack a differentiation between hands and arms, same for feet, and are covering that.

Tweaking this should help a good bit against goliaths, but their timer might still need increasing, given slower movementspeed and possible lag.

[Pckables]

I have noticed that Goliath tentacles are a bit faster than they used to be, but they're still very consistently dodge-able (unless you're a diona). On the other hand goliaths have lost the eye-flashy tell they'd do when they were about to attack.

If you want to talk about a basic lavaland mob punishing players for a single mistake, take a look at yellow swarmers. They rush you down at max speed and instantly tase you in melee for a long 5+ second stun, after which you'll be dead because the other swarmers shot you with lasers on the ground.
Also it seems swarmers detect and try to attack you through walls right now, which I think might be a bug.

Edited June 4, 2019 by Pckables

[MarsMond]

2 hours ago, Pckables said:

On the other hand goliaths have lost the eye-flashy tell they'd do when they were about to attack.

They didn't fully loose it, but their eyes turn red instead. Given how small the eyes are, hard to notice, but possible.

[MrMagolor]

7 hours ago, Pckables said:

I have noticed that Goliath tentacles are a bit faster than they used to be, but they're still very consistently dodge-able (unless you're a diona). On the other hand goliaths have lost the eye-flashy tell they'd do when they were about to attack.

If you want to talk about a basic lavaland mob punishing players for a single mistake, take a look at yellow swarmers. They rush you down at max speed and instantly tase you in melee for a long 5+ second stun, after which you'll be dead because the other swarmers shot you with lasers on the ground.
Also it seems swarmers detect and try to attack you through walls right now, which I think might be a bug.

Breen and xerdies can tell you about the endless pain I had as a seed vault diona because of those. But that's an issue for its own thread.

 

And again, the issue is bone breaks, as there are not many adequate hand/feet armors that exist period, let alone accessible to miners.

[improvedname]

This sounds like really an issue, because you were a diona. species that are slow by standard, the tickrate isn't really a issue.

The tentacles can be easily avoided. you just move whenever it has red eyes(or prepare to atleast)

Bone breaking is a really edge case scenario. because you have around you alot of instaheals(or well get them atleast) which is basically a admin heal fixing your bones etc

so bone breaking isn't a instant death sentence but its to add to the difficulty of lavaland with baymed, another thing you can

(which i always do when fighting megafauna) is bringing stimpaks for some extra speed they just cost 50 points. yes they cause brain damage but better then dying right?

[MrMagolor]

On 6/4/2019 at 10:00 AM, improvedname said:

This sounds like really an issue, because you were a diona. species that are slow by standard, the tickrate isn't really a issue.

The tentacles can be easily avoided. you just move whenever it has red eyes(or prepare to atleast)

Bone breaking is a really edge case scenario. because you have around you alot of instaheals(or well get them atleast) which is basically a admin heal fixing your bones etc

so bone breaking isn't a instant death sentence but its to add to the difficulty of lavaland with baymed, another thing you can

(which i always do when fighting megafauna) is bringing stimpaks for some extra speed they just cost 50 points. yes they cause brain damage but better then dying right?

The issue is: if your bones break and you somehow get out alive, you can't kill a legion because you'll drop your weapons.

[improvedname]

Then get a legion core before you fight something like that

[BeanOS]

Goliath are slow, if you want to engage them in melee, which imo you shouldn't, you wait for them to take a step forward, because directly after taking that step there is a small window of opportunity to step close enough and hit them, without them retaliating.
You must have at least two tiles between you and the Goliath, because they can attack while moving, so you wait for them to close the gap to a one tile distance, then you step forward, hit them, take two steps away, repeat.
As a diona you are way too slow to take advantage of attack pause after moving the Goliath has.

You don't even need to watch for the tell from the Goliath for their ground tentacles, as they do not root or cause damage to you until they get to the peak of their animation, giving you about a second from their original appearance, to step off of those tiles.

[MrMagolor]

1 minute ago, BeanOS said:

Goliath are slow, if you want to engage them in melee, which imo you shouldn't, you wait for them to take a step forward, because directly after taking that step there is a small window of opportunity to step close enough and hit them, without them retaliating.
You must have at least two tiles between you and the Goliath, because they can attack while moving, so you wait for them to close the gap to a one tile distance, then you step forward, hit them, take two steps away, repeat.
As a diona you are way too slow to take advantage of attack pause after moving the Goliath has.

You don't even need to watch for the tell from the Goliath for their ground tentacles, as they do not root or cause damage to you until they get to the peak of their animation, giving you about a second from their original appearance, to step off of those tiles.

1. Ash walkers.

2. A second is not really very long to react, especially if you're already slowed from either being a diona or having bones broken.

[BeanOS]

Just now, MrMagolor said:

1. Ash walkers.

2. A second is not really very long to react, especially if you're already slowed from either being a diona or having bones broken.

1. What about Ash Walkers?

2. As I said, it is rough for Diona, but Diona heal rapidly, so it is less of an issue, also they have no bones to break.

[MrMagolor]

Just now, BeanOS said:

1. What about Ash Walkers?

2. As I said, it is rough for Diona, but Diona heal rapidly, so it is less of an issue, also they have no bones to break.

Ash walkers don't get ranged: for that matter they can't use ranged, similar to golems.

[BeanOS]

Just now, MrMagolor said:

Ash walkers don't get ranged: for that matter they can't use ranged, similar to golems.

Ash walkers are faster than humans, they can take advantage of that movement speed to deal with Goliath far easier than crew can.

[MrMagolor]

Just now, BeanOS said:

Ash walkers are faster than humans, they can take advantage of that movement speed to deal with Goliath far easier than crew can.

The Goliath tick-timer can feel random, so even if you kite properly you can get randomly hit.

 

And again, the issue with slowness isn't diona, it's people that are already wounded.

[BeanOS]

1 minute ago, MrMagolor said:

The Goliath tick-timer can feel random, so even if you kite properly you can get randomly hit.

 

And again, the issue with slowness isn't diona, it's people that are already wounded.

Don't engage a Goliath if you are wounded.