DNR in Medical SoP

[MattTheFicus]

During a Discord conversation it was discussed that the standard practice for suicides in the Brig (including ones where they just beat themselves to death because they're Tiders) is typically to tag em as DNR and let that be the end of that. I know in the past I've AHelp'ed for permission to do so and was given the green light. Is it possible to add to Medical General or Coroner SoP that suicides are to be treated as DNR? Or to expand on it, maybe list cases where DNR is to be applied under Coroner SoP (such as executions). I know Coroner SoP states: "The Coroner must ensure Security-based DNR Notices (such as executed personnel, for instance) are respected", but having a list of said DNR cases under Medical SoP may help prevent cases of Coroners or even Doctors from accidentally reviving DNR-marked bodybags.

[WingedYordle]

I believe it is given but adding it won’t hurt.

[MattTheFicus]

another point from a later Disc conversation, it might be nice to clarify certain rulings, such as death in a lethal firefight with Security.

[Kyet]

Is it even possible to revive suicided people?
I'd rather it was just impossible, instead of it being possible but having SOP not to do it.

[Abydos]

1 hour ago, Kyet said:

Is it even possible to revive suicided people?
I'd rather it was just impossible, instead of it being possible but having SOP not to do it.

It is possible by removing the brain of the suicided person, placing them into a new body and then SR/Clone/Defib that body.

[Eler00]

While you can't revive someone that uses the suicide verb normally, many people that kill themselves in sec custody do it via punching themselves or similiar. That doesn't set the suicide flag like using the verb does.

[necaladun]

I'd be quite fine with something like this being added - if people want to kill themselves I don't see any need to bring them back into the round, they made their choice.

Actual wording of SoP I haven't had enough coffee to do yet though

[MattTheFicus]

3 hours ago, Eler00 said:

While you can't revive someone that uses the suicide verb normally, many people that kill themselves in sec custody do it via punching themselves or similiar. That doesn't set the suicide flag like using the verb does.

This. The amount of times i have to treat people 2-3+ times as Warden for punching themselves to death, then getting the straitjacket, and eventually just saying "fuck it" and bodybagging them due to Slings/Clings/Tators being more important that a Civvie punching himself to death over a 15min sentence, is a tad nuts. I REALLY hate doing it, but at the same time, wasting 10 minutes on someone who's just doing it for attention or to annoy Security isnt gonna catch much sympathy from me.

I do think that there needs to be some sort of "warning" written into the SoP so that a Warden/HoS/Officer can say "Hey, buddy, youre gonna have to NOT do that, because if you continue, we're not obligated to treat/stop you". Perhaps give the Psych a job to do, by having them declare them Suicidal or something? (though this might not work as well due to many Psychs just playing the role for access to meth/weed/etc and just disappearing) Those would be the small nitpicky SoP rules thatd have to be thought of to make it so that a new player can be TAUGHT that punching yourself to death isnt "sticking it to the Sec Team" but instead just makes their lives more frustrating because the prisoner cant handle punishment (which is USUALLY rather small, anyway) for their choices.

[Mitchs98]

5 hours ago, MattTheFicus said:

"Hey, buddy, youre gonna have to NOT do that, because if you continue, we're not obligated to treat/stop you"

That already exists. You aren't obligated to treat people in security that are harming themselves by any means at all. The only thing that's not in there is medbay reviving them after their sentence is over. People just choose to treat prisoners doing it, for whatever reason, and I have to constantly remind them they don't have to.

[Kozack]

my problem is currently the Russian revolver only counts as suicide if they type "suicide" but if they "Play Russian roulette" it doesn't. So they are able to be revived by attaching the head and cloning them. usually I'm lucky and they don't go back into their body when scanned, but still it's annoying that by SoP I have to at least try.

[Mitchs98]

7 hours ago, Kozack said:

my problem is currently the Russian revolver only counts as suicide if they type "suicide" but if they "Play Russian roulette" it doesn't. So they are able to be revived by attaching the head and cloning them. usually I'm lucky and they don't go back into their body when scanned, but still it's annoying that by SoP I have to at least try.

Nothing in SOP states medbay MUST treat people, actually. It's assumed you would under normal circumstances, however nothing at all tells you you have to treat people that shoot themselves with russian revolvers or other evident self harm outside of the suicide command. I.E drinking themselves to death, beating themselves to death in front of you, refusing treatment while actively dying and running away, etc.

Medbay itself has no SOP on self harm or suicide. It's just common practice for most doctors to not treat people for it.

[Kozack]

Unfortunately under the CMO SoP the CMO must ensure all cloneable corpses are cloned falls under that. If you can reattach the head and clone it, you have to under CMO SoP.

[Mitchs98]

1 hour ago, Kozack said:

Unfortunately under the CMO SoP the CMO must ensure all cloneable corpses are cloned falls under that. If you can reattach the head and clone it, you have to under CMO SoP.

I actually never noticed that SOP. Unfortunate.

Suicide SOP certainly needs to be added to main medical SOP.

[Kozack]

yeah, I'm glad I noticed it, cause I hate wasting resources on greytide.