Admin Complaint: Drakeven

[Englishformula]

Admin(s) Key: Drakeven
Your ckey (Byond username): Englishformula
Your Discord name (if applicable): English Formula 

Date(s) of incident (GMT preferred): 2021/01/25 - 3:00 AM EST

Nature of complaint: Methodically and intentionally un-wrenched pipe preventing the movement of swarmer's. 
(miss-application of rules, misconduct)

TLDR: Drakeven broke Rule 0, but said he did not break Rule 0.

Myself and a 2 other swarmer's were doing our thing in perma-brig until Security came to crash the party. 2 of us vented and one seemingly got out, another stayed put for awhile but made a barrier to slow down Sec. Soon after he vented, but by that point, Jay Chase (Drakeven) had un-wrenched the only pipe leading out of the department. Because we vented while he unwrenched, we could neither see the unwrenched pipe, nor deal with it. This is generally something players don't do, as antagonists cannot fix pipes, and the sprites for broken pipes are barely distinguishable from a connected pipe. Often the pipe is hidden by the tile removed to get to it in the first place. I assume this is why we normally don't let people do this. Once I ahelped, I was instead told that "methodically" or "strategically" removing pipes to prevent vent crawling antags from escaping is in fact a strategy, and that you're perfectly able to unwrench pipes in the incredibly specific circumstances laid out in this situation. I should probably also mention that Drakeven acted like Jay was infact a random player, up until I straight up asked them if it was them; Referring to the individual who unwrenched the pipe as "they". Which admittingly comes off as a bit shady. In the end, I was told after admin deliberation, this was not a rule break. Though, I should not that this is against the rules as per Kyet. I have attached the appropriate file folder. I'd rather not get into a debate, but this rule does not mention any circumstances, it states that it's against the rules. 

Thank you for your time. 

 

 

[necaladun]

Hi there,

I've read over the logs here, and Drakeven discussed this with the other admins before attempting to handle it herself. Marginalorb agreed that the unwrenching wasn't excessive, but had to leave - in this case, with no other options and trying to get others to handle it first, Drak handling it is expected.

Quote

[2021-01-25T07:59:21] ADMIN: PM: Drakeven/(Jay Chase)->Englishformula/(a swarmer): No, it's not. Wrenching up pipes at vital intersections thoughout the station is. Two pipes to trap a swarmer that they already know about is okay. Likewise, if sec knew there was an queen of terror in electircal, they would be within their rights to wrench up the escape route she has and then attack her.
[2021-01-25T07:59:54] ADMIN: PM: Englishformula/(a swarmer)->Drakeven/(Jay Chase): So its okay to wrench up pipes strategically ?
[2021-01-25T07:59:57] ADMIN: PM: Drakeven/(Jay Chase)->Englishformula/(a swarmer): If they wrenched up pipes in the HOPES that she would make a mistake and fall out of a pipe somewhere, then yes you'd be correct. Like most things, context comes into play here.
[2021-01-25T08:00:32] ADMIN: PM: Drakeven/(Jay Chase)->Englishformula/(a swarmer): If you know about a threat and it's their only escape route, then yes- you can wrench up pipes to trap them. If you don't know where the threat is and just want to stop them from using pipes, then no you can't do that. 

Drak was correct here - cutting off an escape route temporarily is not "breaking the atmos net in order to hamper antags". The intent of this rule was to stop people unwrenching multiple pipes (and often hiding them with other items) across the station - often pre-emptively and in strategic locations - and breaking the atmos network and severely hampering antags. In this case a temporary removal in response to a direct threat is quite different, and a reasonable response. 

This case seems like a deliberate response to an antag attempting to escape equivalent to a sec team having an AI bolt a door in front of a running traitor or routing them with another sec team, not the equivalent of bolting every door into entire station departments because 'bad man might want to go there'

I don't see Drak saying you can do it "strategically" or "methodically" anywhere.  I'm not sure why you you put those words in quotes when you're not quoting anyone?

Methodically unwrenching pipes across the station is certainly not on, and in no way did Drak ever say. Think of the door bolting example above (Which I totally stole from @Dumbdumn5), or randomly force feeding holy water to the crew. Doing these in response to an immediate and active situation is fine - methodically doing it in advance is not and considered excessive. 

We'll look into rewording things so this can be a bit clearer.

Complaint is without merit and resolved.