Add slowdown to Security Riot/Bulletproof armor

[Rurik]

(MELEE = 50, BULLET = 5, LASER = 5, ENERGY = 5, BOMB = 0, BIO = 0, RAD = 0, FIRE = 200, ACID = 200)

(MELEE = 10, BULLET = 50, LASER = 5, ENERGY = 5, BOMB = 35, BIO = 0, RAD = 0, FIRE = 50, ACID = 50)

These are the armor values for riot and bulletproof armor, respectively. Both of them cover *every* limb, including hands, feet, excluding only the head to leave a use for the helmet.

These two items cost 0 TC, 0 PvE requirement, while also having 0 drawbacks and covers each limb. The moment armory opens security are free to wear them the rest of the shift with absolutely no consequence for half-off a damage type. Because of the additional factor of protecting hands/feet, there is also no counter-play aside from choosing a weapon with armor pen. Or, of course, choose a different weapon, but TC isn't adaptive like that.

Personally I don't think something as powerful as half-off a damage type should be paired with no drawbacks. These should be situational, not choose-your-flavor candies you pick up and wear the rest of the shift cause why not. Dufflebag tier slowdown would solve this issue handedly, although I'm not entirely satisfied with slowdown being the answer to every armor. I'd prefer a different solution, but I don't see one.

[McRamon]

while i agree that it makes sense to add some sort of a drawback, slowdown will just nerf them into nothing, except for some niche situations perhaps. Tspiders, cult, basic antags, nukies, all of them will kill you because of the speed.

[LforLouise]

right ok, presume i am insane for suggesting this, but...

what if everything had a weight, everything larger than a pen. except for unprotective clothing, or something like that... and there were limits to how much a person could carry.
carry capacity is only limited by how large your bag is. i can fit like 5 piano synths in my bag, which makes me incredibly strong (dont heck with me), but like, why?

species could have different weight capacity, going over your carry capacity will slow you down until you cannot pick up anymore. remove duffel slowdown all together - an empty but larger bag shouldnt slow you down more than a full satchel (which doesnt slow you down at all).

stuff like riot armours would be quite heavy (as they should be, considering they are lumps of metal and kevlar and magical bluespace protection), and effectively restrict you from carrying too many items, especially not in a backpack, if you want to walk at normal speeds. guns would also be rather heavy, cos guns arent just cheap plastic toys, they are military hardware, steel is not light.

yea that was a rather psychotic suggestion but its a complicated solution to a simple problem.

Edited October 28, 2022 by LforLouise

[Boardwalksky]

58 minutes ago, LforLouise said:

right ok, presume i am insane for suggesting this, but...

what if everything had a weight, everything larger than a pen. except for unprotective clothing, or something like that... and there were limits to how much a person could carry.
carry capacity is only limited by how large your bag is. i can fit like 5 piano synths in my bag, which makes me incredibly strong (dont heck with me), but like, why?

species could have different weight capacity, going over your carry capacity will slow you down until you cannot pick up anymore. remove duffel slowdown all together - an empty but larger bag shouldnt slow you down more than a full satchel (which doesnt slow you down at all).

stuff like riot armours would be quite heavy (as they should be, considering they are lumps of metal and kevlar and magical bluespace protection), and effectively restrict you from carrying too many items, especially not in a backpack, if you want to walk at normal speeds. guns would also be rather heavy, cos guns arent just cheap plastic toys, they are military hardware, steel is not light.

yea that was a rather psychotic suggestion but its a complicated solution to a simple problem.

Eh, I feel like people would argue over weight capacities and it would be more complicated then needed. That, and if species can carry different amounts, it encourages people to play a specific race for powergame reasons.

 

adding to the main conversation, while their should be some downsides, I feel like if you put a speed nerf, a lot of people won’t even think of using it, due to how being slow can easily lose you most fights, yo

[Shaw]

I was under the impression that: 

sec using riot armor? Shoot them. 
sec using bulletproof? Stab them. 
 

plus the energy/laser reduction is rather low on both, it’s practically negligible. I think they’re fine as is and compel antags to be adaptable in their weaponry. Or at the least, have an energy weapon. 

[Bmon]

There are obvious counters to each type of armour, a slow down or any other type of drawback would be unnecessary. 

Honestly, normal armour is pretty useless right now since you can target any limb to negate almost all of it. What we should do is a damage cap on each limb to force people to actually aim for the head/chest.

[Boardwalksky]

44 minutes ago, Bmon said:

There are obvious counters to each type of armour, a slow down or any other type of drawback would be unnecessary. 

Honestly, normal armour is pretty useless right now since you can target any limb to negate almost all of it. What we should do is a damage cap on each limb to force people to actually aim for the head/chest.

I like that idea  but think changing body parts mid fight to sound like a hassle. 

[Bmon]

14 hours ago, Boardwalksky said:

I like that idea  but think changing body parts mid fight to sound like a hassle. 

Then just target the chest/head and don't go for the limbs. That's exactly it works on TG.

[Boardwalksky]

14 hours ago, Bmon said:

Then just target the chest/head and don't go for the limbs. That's exactly it works on TG.

Stupid question, but what’s the downside of using a lethal weapon and only aiming for the head instead of the limbs? Sounds like the easiest way to kill someone

[Bmon]

On 10/30/2022 at 12:33 PM, Boardwalksky said:

Stupid question, but what’s the downside of using a lethal weapon and only aiming for the head instead of the limbs? Sounds like the easiest way to kill someone

On TG a 357. round will deal 60 DMG no matter where you hit them, it's just that if you shoot someone in their leg it caps out and disables it or decapitates that limb(if the weapon is sharp). You're not able to kill someone by shooting their leg unless you inflict a wound and cause them to bleed out.

Aiming for the head or chest on TG allows you to stack someone with enough damage to kill them, the downside being that's where you're most likely to be wearing armour.

None of this matters on Paradise because our limbs have no damage cap so you're free to shoot someone in their pinky toe 100 times to kill them.

[Boardwalksky]

Oh, so this is why spam opening and closing a cheap lighter will stack burn damage so quickly my lungs collapse. Yeah then, damage caps sound pretty good

6 hours ago, Bmon said:

On TG a 357. round will deal 60 DMG no matter where you hit them, it's just that if you shoot someone in their leg it caps out and disables it or decapitates that limb(if the weapon is sharp). You're not able to kill someone by shooting their leg unless you inflict a wound and cause them to bleed out.

Aiming for the head or chest on TG allows you to stack someone with enough damage to kill them, the downside being that's where you're most likely to be wearing armour.

None of this matters on Paradise because our limbs have no damage cap so you're free to shoot someone in their pinky toe 100 times to kill them.