belarion Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 Currently, to show a cultist the light you need to either whack them about with the null rod, or force feed them some holy water. Typically once the AI spots a rune in engineering once the cult is discovered the chaplain is deputized and anyone who gets caught is rapidly brought back into the NT fold, often checkpoints get set up and random folks get a holy watering. Considering how difficult it is for the cultists to recruit new members (typically having to stun and drag them onto a rune), they're very easily de-antagged, even easier than de-converting revs since unlike loyalty implants holy water isn't at all hard to mass produce. Maybe make de-converting cultists a little bit more complicated, so sec has to do more than just bring the chaplain over to bless their watertank? Requiring Cultists to be located in the chapel to be de-converted makes a lot more sense if they're being "purged of sin" IMO. Kinda like how vampires can't step in there, Nar'sie is also an eldritch abomination no? Cultists are loyalty implant immune, presumably because of Nar'sie's power, it'd kinda makes more sense if they were de-convertable in the one place in the station where he'd presumably have none. Of course that'd just mean that once the Cult reaches critical mass it'd be pretty impossible to de-convert anyone, maybe have the null rod work outside the chapel bur require it to take a few whacks to the head? Most of the Cult rounds I've played in usually see the cult either be super secret and summon Nar'sie when no one expects it, have the cult act like revs and complete wreck the station, or sec catches them all in the first half hour, its not really a "balance" idea so much as it is a "makes more sense" one, would it work better though? Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthdivine Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 Currently, to show a cultist the light you need to either whack them about with the null rod This doesn't work anymore as far as I've witnessed, I've even managed to avoid getting deconverted by making the Chaplin hit me with the Null Rod and then got released under the guise of "seeing the light"....Captain dragged me back to security personally to deconvert me properly though The biggest problem with cults is they DO NOT utilize all their powers. It's very easy to get people without outing yourself but no one ever uses it. Grab some stun talismans and summon a ghost, have him run around and convert for you. Make an artificer and have the constructs distract and deal with security while you convert. Most cults get rid of the holy water and bible as fast as possible to avoid being deconverted. The openness of Holy Water is to combat that. Other then the Chaplin, the only other source is Chemistry, causing the cult to be killed upon sight if no one can make it Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23301 Share on other sites More sharing options...
belarion Posted February 25, 2015 Author Posted February 25, 2015 This doesn't work anymore as far as I've witnessed, I've even managed to avoid getting deconverted by making the Chaplin hit me with the Null Rod and then got released under the guise of "seeing the light"....Captain dragged me back to security personally to deconvert me properly though The biggest problem with cults is they DO NOT utilize all their powers. It's very easy to get people without outing yourself but no one ever uses it. Grab some stun talismans and summon a ghost, have him run around and convert for you. Make an artificer and have the constructs distract and deal with security while you convert. Most cults get rid of the holy water and bible as fast as possible to avoid being deconverted. The openness of Holy Water is to combat that. Other then the Chaplin, the only other source is Chemistry, causing the cult to be killed upon sight if no one can make it Yeah, Cults hardly ever use more than one or two of their powers. I think I've seen the teleport rune use twice in the year and a bit I've playing, the wall rune used once, and the summon ghosts rune about three times. The experience level (kek) of most cultists is typically very low, you occasionally get someone who knows what they're doing who'll go off and research words/build a cult base, but 90% of the time? The Cult is just played as another form of greytide. I definitely think the Null rod should have more anti-cult use, its what its for after all (other than being mega robust), if it doesn't de-convert that means all its good for is cracking skulls and destroying runes. Like I said its not really a balance idea, would having the null rod work outside the chapel (maybe 1/3 chance to deconvert per head whack?), and holy water inside be balanced though, Considering the robustness of the average cult? Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23303 Share on other sites More sharing options...
veganzombeh Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 I like the idea of it only being possible in the chapel. I think, once fed holy water, cultists should be given a choice as to whether or not they wish to de-convert. If they choose not to, security could just permabrig or execute them. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23318 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthdivine Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 I like the idea of it only being possible in the chapel. I think, once fed holy water, cultists should be given a choice as to whether or not they wish to de-convert. If they choose not to, security could just permabrig or execute them. Well the cult was always meant to be viewed as basically possession by Nar'sie. You don't get a choice in the matter, you DO what it tells you to do. I'll point Fox and Mark to this thread once they're online. I definitely think the Null rod should have more anti-cult use, its what its for after all (other than being mega robust), if it doesn't de-convert that means all its good for is cracking skulls and destroying runes. I think it was changed since you could just throw it out and never deal with it again, while with holy water the Chaplin is a threat for all states of the game until he dies. Also i believe the Null Rod also keeps the Chaplin from being converted in the first place, maybe extend that power to the other rune powers like Stun and Blind to give him more power. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23321 Share on other sites More sharing options...
veganzombeh Posted February 25, 2015 Posted February 25, 2015 Another thing I think would hugely improve cult strategies is if the mask could speak to cultists more frequently. Currently, if you're trying to converse with one of your cultists you have to wait about two minutes to reply sometimes, which just leads to cultists ignoring the mask and doing their own thing. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23326 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Pretty sure the coders are about to remove the mask and port in /tg/ cult. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23345 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coldflame Posted February 26, 2015 Posted February 26, 2015 Well the cult was always meant to be viewed as basically possession by Nar'sie. You don't get a choice in the matter, you DO what it tells you to do. I'll point Fox and Mark to this thread once they're online.. How about something along the lines of a popup? "You see a light approach you, and it attempts to pull you from Nar'Sie's cold embrace. Do you follow it? y/n" Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/3622-ltideagt-make-it-a-bit-harder-to-de-convert-cultists/#findComment-23347 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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