Should All Borgs Get Crowbar Modules for Depowered Doors?

[Surrealistik]

 

Per the title.

 

Easily one of the most frustrating/annoying and IMO entirely unnecessary things about playing a non-Engi borg: being stopped dead cold by any kind of depowered door. Doubly so as Security/Medical borgs.

 

Edited May 25, 2015 by Guest

[Fj45]

 

Why in the ninehells would you have "abstain" in a poll?!

 

Seriously, stop with polls, if people want to voice their viewpoint then we have this fancy thing called "commenting."

 

[Surrealistik]

 

Neutrality/indifference. It's good to have it as a point of reference in order to encompass as much sentiment as possible.

 

And polls are a decent starting point for gauging sentiment, particularly as it's protected by anonymity.

 

[Plotron]

In addition, you can change your mind if somebody persuades you and it will be reflected in the poll.

[veganzombeh]

I voted no. Borgs already have too much multi-functionality. Giving borgs tools that have nothing to do with their jobs is IMO something we should not do.

[Fox McCloud]

 

I voted no. Borgs already have too much multi-functionality. Giving borgs tools that have nothing to do with their jobs is IMO something we should not do.

 

This, pretty much.

 

[Surrealistik]

 

I voted no. Borgs already have too much multi-functionality. Giving borgs tools that have nothing to do with their jobs is IMO something we should not do.

 

Wait, what? No they don't.

 

As mentioned elsewhere, nearly all the borg types can't even fully perform the functions of the department they were made to specialize at (pretty much all of them but the Janiborg), and are routinely outperformed at their job by their humanoid counterparts, while _also_ being bereft of their freedom. Hell, some of them can't even perform basic functions pertinent to their role like shaking awake, applying anesthetic, or feeding rad collectors.

 

Having a crowbar so that depowering doesn't prevent borgs from performing their jobs in the first place has everything to do with them; again especially true of Medical and Security models (in the case of the latter, Deathsquad and Combat borg types already have access tools to pursue antags; even plasma cutters!): gaining access to patients and suspects is definitely and directly related to their primary functions.

 

Note that I did feature a no vote that approves of adding the crowbar module to certain cyborg types if you feel it should only be granted to those that benefit more directly from it; this poll isn't first past the post, so there's no need to vote strategically.

 

[Fj45]

 

You don't get the damn point! Borgs are supposed to be good, but not perfect! They can't do all the things humans can. They should never be able to do entirely everything a human can!

 

Damn near every suggestion you post is "give borgs more power."

 

And stop with the damn polls.

 

[Surrealistik]

 

You don't get the damn point! Borgs are supposed to be good, but not perfect! They can't do all the things humans can. They should never be able to do entirely everything a human can!

 

Damn near every suggestion you post is "give borgs more power."

 

And stop with the damn polls.

 

They're neither good or perfect, that's the problem, and that's precisely why I advocate improving borgs consistently. Again, the problem isn't that they can't do all the things humans can, and no one's asking for that; losing flexibility is one of the main costs of being a borg, it's that they're inferior to humanoids within the context of their own specialization, while also completely lacking the ability to do basic or important tasks within that specialization.

 

Bottom line, Borgs are supposed to be specialized units that trade versatility and freedom for especial proficiency within their department of focus but they don't actually get that.

 

 

Also this is the only poll thread I've ever made.

 

[Citinited]

Unpowered doors are, in theory, one of the few ways crewmembers can stop a rogue borg dead. A power outage severe enough to unpower doors should make borgs unable to do much, IMO.

[Surrealistik]

 

Unpowered doors are, in theory, one of the few ways crewmembers can stop a rogue borg dead. A power outage severe enough to unpower doors should make borgs unable to do much, IMO.

 

Power outages are generally local, not stationwide when they happen, and sec already has ion rifles, flashes, and the Robotics Control console to deal with rogue borgs pretty much effortlessly.

 

Not to mention most borgs can't even deal with desks, tables, or welded doors.

 

[Plotron]

 

 

They're neither good or perfect, that's the problem, and that's precisely why I advocate improving borgs consistently. Again, the problem isn't that they can't do all the things humans can, and no one's asking for that; losing flexibility is one of the main costs of being a borg, it's that they're inferior to humanoids within the context of their own specialization, while also completely lacking the ability to do basic or important tasks within that specialization.

 

Bottom line, Borgs are supposed to be specialized units that trade versatility and freedom for especial proficiency within their department of focus but they don't actually get that.

 

 

A valid point here, considering that crew is often encouraged to get borged in Robotics.

 

[Surrealistik]

 

A valid point here, considering that crew is often encouraged to get borged in Robotics.

 

Haha, not sure whether that's sarcasm (because they theoretically wouldn't be encouraged if borgs were bad) or you're actually agreeing with me (borging should be decent because people are pressured to get borgified).

 

I have to say though, I've never seen crew encouraged to get borged by anyone other than the AI for obvious reasons, though occasionally an antag will try to pitch it to his murder victim for a stealth valid.

 

[Plotron]

 

Roboticists encourage people.

 

And sometimes you get a shitfest because of lack of proper paperwork.

 

[davidchan]

 

If someone is being an utter shit to me as a roboticist, I will forge a 'Cyborgification upon death/Do not resuscitate or clone' form and get the Captain to stamp on it. Wait for a while (building a Crew Monitor helps or getting a portable crew monitor) and wait for them to die. Steal the corpse and shove the form in anyone's face who tries to stop you.

 

Borg the individual and give them a direct order to become a Service or Miner borg upon installing the MMI into the endoskeleton, so their laws mandate they carry it out. Now I have a robotic bitch to get me drunk or get me materials.

 

[Surrealistik]

Bump!

[Earthdivine]

 

Unpowered doors are, in theory, one of the few ways crewmembers can stop a rogue borg dead. A power outage severe enough to unpower doors should make borgs unable to do much, IMO.

 

Sec already has ion rifles, flashes, and the Robotics Control console to deal with rogue borgs pretty much effortlessly.

 

I am actually very late on this but Rogue borgs don't show up on the Console outside of Malf rounds.

 

[veganzombeh]

 

As mentioned elsewhere, nearly all the borg types can't even fully perform the functions of the department they were made to specialize at (pretty much all of them but the Janiborg), and are routinely outperformed at their job by their humanoid counterparts, while _also_ being bereft of their freedom. Hell, some of them can't even perform basic functions pertinent to their role like shaking awake, applying anesthetic, or feeding rad collectors.

 

I don't see the problem with this, personally. Cyborgs aren't intended to outperform their human counterparts. Cyborgs are there to assist humans, not replace them.

 

[Surrealistik]

 

@ Earthdivine: I mean rogue more generally, as in Cyborgs that aren't emagged, but need to be stopped anyways (MalfAI, shit lawset, cyborg interpreting laws in a disruptive way, etc).

 

 

As mentioned elsewhere, nearly all the borg types can't even fully perform the functions of the department they were made to specialize at (pretty much all of them but the Janiborg), and are routinely outperformed at their job by their humanoid counterparts, while _also_ being bereft of their freedom. Hell, some of them can't even perform basic functions pertinent to their role like shaking awake, applying anesthetic, or feeding rad collectors.

 

I don't see the problem with this, personally. Cyborgs aren't intended to outperform their human counterparts. Cyborgs are there to assist humans, not replace them.

 

The problem is it makes no sense from a gameplay perspective and even a perspective of realism (no need for uber expensive specialized machines if a human is significantly better at their job, and they can't even perform basic tasks within their specialization); the cost/benefit tradeoff is skewed; you give up far too much for far too little; this is a big problem with cyborgs generally.

 

[Plotron]

Cue in service cyborgs, whose best feature is dosh dispenser and a self-replenishing 100u beaker of whatever you can find.

[davidchan]

 

Cue in service cyborgs, whose best feature is dosh dispenser and a self-replenishing 100u beaker of whatever you can find.

 

 

 

 

[Surrealistik]

 

Cue in service cyborgs, whose best feature is dosh dispenser and a self-replenishing 100u beaker of whatever you can find.

 

 

 

 

That was basically the inspiration for it.

 

Also the dosh dispenser is definitely retarded.