Another dreadweaver complaint

[Sirhelgate]

 

This time, it's less there was a problem, and more the behavior of the admin is getting stupid.

 

ADMINKEY: DREADWEAVER

 

GAMETYPE: Cultist

 

The main issue with the round in question on the morning of 7/12/2015, came down to a matter of the captain repeatedly lowering the alert to the lowest possible, while there seemed to be greytide murder going on in the locker room. Then bulma steals the chaplains flask for going around and making sure no one else is a cultist at the request of security. All the while security is pushing for the captain to be removed and is setting up an escape checkpoint to search for possible cultists.

 

Meanwhile bulma as well as some slime person at the time steals the bible, flask, nullrod, and security issued tazer from the chaplain. All while in the middle of that bulma is selling drugs in the bar. Leading the chaplain to beleive heavily both are cultists, as this is also illegal behavior. Then for some reason complete hell breaks loose as security sees bulma enter the escape point and try to arrest her for the selling of drugs, admitted theft of the chaplains personnel anti-cult belongings and flushing them down a disposal where they got picked dry or were taken from already. This leads to dread weaver whining over ooc chat that security is shit and ignoring the SOP as beepsky is destroyed in the escape lobby by rioters, alongside other security that's being disarmed and beaten with their own stunbattons. Meanwhile the captain nil stands there after having buckle cuffed the complaining chaplain as his security force is beaten to death around him, and he starts freeing the people who they arrested, bulma included, who continue to cause chaos untill the shuttle arives.

 

This complaint isn't about the ridiculous behavior of the character bulma, but about how dreadweaver whined about SOP when the captain refused to raise the alert status and continued to drop it. The same while he was saying how the last cultist died out an hour ago, despite collntinued criminal activity from the people during the shift. All of which the security continued at first to point out to the captain and AI they can't do anything under the current alert status about the thefts. So they decide to ignore the security status as the captain was not raising it and keeping it from being raised. To that extent dreadweaver behaved un-adminly and whined and complained about how it was a shitsecuirty round, and how when he commits crimes they should be ignored, even if he commits them in front of security personnel, all because the 'SOP isn't high enough for you to arrest and search me!'

 

THE SHORT AND SWEET:

Dreadweaver got bitchy because he got arrested, and started lording his red text over the chat acting like security was breaking the rules by acting against the captian's poor judgment of degrading all the way to the lowest status, then justified it with, 'and the last cultist died out a while ago' despite continue suspicious behavior. So he spent his time whining about SOP over OOC chat, simply because he got arrested for breaking the law. Ontop of that one of the admins was playing loud and extremely obnoxious midis that I had to turn off, this is easily remedied by switching off the midis. But this behavior in general is out of hand for an admin.

 

TO SUM IT UP!

 

[dreadweaver]

 

*sigh* here we go again.

 

1. You were that chaplain. I was sitting in the bar, talking to people over the radio. You walked up to me and started feeding me holy water without a single word. No 'hello Bulma, please drink some holy water so I can verify you are not a cultist', no nothing. I disarmed you and threw the flask into the disposal chute, to which you responded with announcing that I sm a possible cultist over the radio. I never touched anything else of yours, and I find your claims that I did to be rather distasteful and rude.

 

Also, you wore an ID titled inquisitor. Lmao

 

2. I wasn't dealing drugs. The drugs were brought there by an unknown party to me, put on the table - I didn't even eat any.

 

3. There was no riot. The crew was getting uneasy because security set up a cultist checking point in escape - without the captains approval. Later an officer tried to arrest me - again without a word. A disarmed his taser and ran to escape. In escape another officer tried to arrest me for having the taser (which I didn't).

 

4. No one was beaten to death. Personally I punched the second officer a few times because by that time I got ICly rather pissed.

 

5. About the 'whining ' - I issues a friendly reminder to everyone what code green means. I wasn't talking to them as an admin (I handle my admin business in PMs) but rather as a player. Security WAS breaking SOP AND not following the captains orders.

 

I don't think I broke any server rules... Or made any administratorial mistakes.

 

(Sorry for the spelling and the lack of proper punctuation - I was writing this from my phone.

 

EDIT: I was majorly disappointed by the UTTER LACK of roleplaying that round on security's part, and how they (and you) tried to desperately seek some VALID KILLZ. Because from your (security's) view point, security isn't there to uphold the law, but to find and murder/imprison/deconvert all the antagonists. This is the shittiest attitude anyone can have towards the game.

 

One more thing. All the cultists were either dead or deconverted by the one hour mark. There could have been NO cultist activity, because there were NO cultists. Multiple people mentioned that they did not know this (how could they know, of course) and that cults can be very stealthy. True. But when the captain decreases the alert level to green, security FOLLOWS ORDERS, and stands down, follows SOP and they don't go full on vigilante while trying to find more antagonists to deal with. Especially not the chaplain, who shouldn't even have a taser. Not on green and not even on blue. Even if the chaplain gets called to fight against the cult, he should be staying in the brig and perform religious rituals and deconvert people, etc etc. Being a full on warrior priest might be cool, but it's really poor RP in my opinion. (yes, I know I did it once, too and I was ashamed of myself for doing it)

 

Shit like this sometimes makes me doubt the legitimacy of the (actually immense amount of) effort I put into administrating the server. I'm rarely angry or mad OOC, but that round made me rather pissed off.

 

Edited July 12, 2015 by Guest

[Dumbdumn5]

I can confirm the issues with security that round, multiple admins/mods over staff chat were complaining about security's behavior and discussing issues regarding crew reaction and behavior.

[necaladun]

 

THE SHORT AND SWEET:

Dreadweaver got bitchy because he got arrested, and started lording his red text over the chat acting like security was breaking the rules by acting against the captian's poor judgment of degrading all the way to the lowest status, then justified it with, 'and the last cultist died out a while ago' despite continue suspicious behavior. So he spent his time whining about SOP over OOC chat, simply because he got arrested for breaking the law. Ontop of that one of the admins was playing loud and extremely obnoxious midis that I had to turn off, this is easily remedied by switching off the midis. But this behavior in general is out of hand for an admin.

 

 

I'm not 100% sure what the complaint is specifically about here. IC in OOC, or was it post round?

 

It seems the Chaplain was acting as a valid-hunter, which they have some excuse for I guess in a cult round...but don't be shocked if people react ICly the same way people would if you tried to force feed them water or bash them with a bible. Violently. I don't see why at all selling drugs in the bar makes you believe someone is a cultist. I've met plenty of people IRL selling drugs in bars and barely any of them were cultists. It's illegal, so you can contact security if your character cares - but the Chaplain is not security. If you want to bust drug dealers, play sec.

 

As for the SOP stuff - if security were acting against SOP, then it's admins jobs to speak to them about it, and potentially point out in OOC or the like that what they did wasn't within SOP, so other players know it is not. Whining about SOP not being followed is quite standard.

 

This complaint isn't about the ridiculous behavior of the character bulma, but about how dreadweaver whined about SOP when the captain refused to raise the alert status and continued to drop it

 

 

It starts in green, I'm not sure how he could have dropped it if it had never been raised.

 

I'll need details on specific things done here to actually uphold this, as nothing you mention is against the rules. If you were the Chaplain, you should have mentioned this in your post. Whining about SOP in OOC? That's fine as long as it's not abusive. That's what OOC is for post-round.

 

The midis were not played by Dread, so I have no idea why you even mentioned it.

 

Without any actual details here, and with you failing to mention -you- were the Chaplain, which is very relevent. Looking at your history, it seems you may even have a grudge against Dreadweaver - especially with the title of this post.

 

Unless you have something substantial to add, I am going to file this as generic whining about someone you don't like, because there is nothing of merit here at all.

 

[Sirhelgate]

 

Admittedly I seem to be rubbed the wrongway by dread.

 

But he was going into using OOC chat to complain about the securities behavior. Which is what I Find uncalled for. Yes, I was the chaplain, I don't deny that.

 

but this problem isn't about how he plays, or his in character playstyle, or even what transpired all of that round. I never really had any problem with any of that happening out of characterly.

 

My point was, there was no point in pointing out to everyone on the station that security is 'shit security' over ooc chat, especially if you're an admin! Then ranting on for five minutes straight over all ooc chat for from before the shuttle even arrived to post round. It's less like he approached the situation with 'lets remind that the captains word is law' and more 'oh god I've been arrested for crimes that people are saying I committed'. For an admin to start berating security and accusing the whole team of being shitsecurity is uncalled for when most of them joined late to the old hos having committed suicide, and it being a cultist round with a large number of people refusing to be subjected to the drink holy water cultist screening. Entirely uncalled for for an admin to up and insult the security staff over ooc chat.

 

Hell, we even had a full thing where security invited people up for a continued screening. Simply because you know when all the cultists have been caught and deconverted doesn't mean sec does.

 

And 'going for valid killz?' you mean security cuffing people and asking for the chaplain to come immediately to adminster holy water? Totally killing them, yep. holy water is totally lethal.

 

Edited July 13, 2015 by Guest

[Dumbdumn5]

 

Admittedly I seem to be rubbed the wrongway by dread.

 

But he was going into using OOC chat to complain about the securities behavior. Which is what I Find uncalled for. Yes, I was the chaplain, I don't deny that.

 

The main issue is he was complaining over OOC chat not even at the end of the round, he spent the whole time going off about SOP from five minutes till shuttle arrival or so, to post round.

 

 

 

What would be uncalled for would be calling sec shitcurity and making a big stink with no actual argument behind it in OOC, and generally trying to spark a bit of chaos.

As Neca said, administrators frequently point out violations of SoP, though usually in the form of PMs if a manageable amount of officers were in violation and not the whole team.

 

The main bit of issue was that the status was raised, and the captain lowered it after it had been raised right in the midst of the arresting of potential cultists. The whole time security was being swamped with grey tide, up untill the very end. So even though there were people who had crimes on them. They were whining ooc about security taking actions against them because SOP.

 

 

Even if the alert level was lowered, people who were marked for searches before the level dropped for known crimes would still be subject to a search.

 

As for whining about action against themselves, did they specifically state officer's names or ckeys, discussing personal issues with the player? Or did they simply discuss what they believed to be broken and state that the general security team should focus on those key points?

 

Dumbdumb is a witness here that the round spiraled out of control at the end of the ground. Beepsky Was destroyed by people all attacking it, security officers were being disarmed and beaten with their own stun sticks, I call that rioting.

 

 

Actually I was on a roadtrip and only got the feedback from staff chat, so I can't help with that here.

 

It's less that Dread was breaking admin rules, I just feel like him complaining about it was uncalled for. Especially after he had admitted to stealing items from the chaplain (my character) over all coms. If that is not reason enough for him to have been arrested and searched. Because the Alert level only prevents random searches. Admitting to theft is reason enough for you to be searched for other illegal goods, especially after you were seen at a table covered in drugs, and everyone else in the round brought up that they watched you peddling the drugs oocly post round.

 

Again, this depends if Dread was specifically talking about his actions as Bulma instead of talking about the issues in general as an admin. There is no doubt that if they admitted to crime and were seen blatantly possessing drugs, then they could be arrested, searched, and if need be, detained for their crimes at any alert level.

 

[Dumbdumn5]

 

My point was, there was no point in pointing out to everyone on the station that security is 'shit security' over ooc chat, especially if you're an admin! Then ranting on for five minutes straight over all ooc chat for from before the shuttle even arrived to post round. It's less like he approached the situation with 'lets remind that the captains word is law' and more 'oh god I've been arrested for crimes that people are saying I committed'. For an admin to start berating security and accusing the whole team of being shitsecurity is uncalled for when most of them joined late to the old hos having committed suicide, and it being a cultist round with a large number of people refusing to be subjected to the drink holy water cultist screening. Entirely uncalled for for an admin to up and insult the security staff over ooc chat.

 

Again, this goes with the issue of them discussing it in terms of their character and sec officers or the general public and all of sec. Bringing up and rattling off SOP isn't really looked upon as insulting in terms of the rules, but more as what an admin is expected to do. If you see something being broken IC or OOC, it's your job to fix it. Although it may not seem to do jack when it's announced, it's still good to at least remind people of what the guidelines are. It isn't uncalled for so much as it's encouraged to talk about SOP over OOC. Unless they up and said "Security is a steaming pile of shit" without putting in anything that could even be remotely seen as an argument or reasonable reaction, then it'd be a fairly normal occurrence. Security is constantly called shitcurity, even though they do have one of, if not the most difficult jobs in the game, and it's usually normal to state the space law and regulations that you've seen ignored. Be it player or admin.

 

Hell, we even had a full thing where security invited people up for a continued screening. Simply because you know when all the cultists have been caught and deconverted doesn't mean sec does.

 

And 'going for valid killz?' you mean security cuffing people and asking for the chaplain to come immediately to adminster holy water? Totally killing them, yep. holy water is totally lethal.

 

Nothing was said about security not understanding that all cultists were detained/executed/deconverted. Continued screening is acceptable, however, at the alert status that they were at (Yes, I'm aware that the captain changed it without approval of the other heads), it was entirely against SOP to act upon suspicion for this type of behavior.

 

As for so-called "validz" it's far from valid hunting when security calls for the chaplain. However chasing and punishing thieves is not under your jurisdiction. At least, that is what I'm lead to believe you did from what I've read prior. Although I might be mistaken.

 

[IcyV]

 

OOC: Dreadweaver: whistles quietly

OOC: Dreadweaver: Security must respect the privacy of crew members and no unauthorized searches are allowed. Searches of any kind may only be done with a signed warrant by the Head of Security or higher, or if found with visible contraband.

OOC: Dreadweaver: Weapons worn by security/headstaff are to be hidden, except in emergencies.

OOC: ZaCyril: Who cares

OOC: ZaCyril: c:

OOC: Themodtester: kEK

OOC: Dreadweaver: continues whistling

OOC: ZaCyril: :c

OOC: Darkeraser: but in green alert they have the right to search anyone

OOC: The Ultimate Chimera: Honk!

 

OOC: Fallinghero: if they search illegally how are you meant to respond?

OOC: LufgtHuron: TIL you can become semiinvisible by eating most parts of your body

OOC: Dreadweaver: I'd like to congratulate security for completely and UTTERLYdisregarding SOP in the last one hour

OOC: Sirhelgate: the issue is the current captain keeps lowering the security level when crimes are happening like theft and security being beaten in the open

OOC: Dreadweaver: good job, guys.

OOC: Fallinghero: can we punch sec if they search illegally?

OOC: WestHybrid: Not all security.

OOC: Qinetix: Yes

OOC: Fallinghero: Good to know.

OOC: Qinetix: But you will get arrested for assault

OOC: Themodtester: Kek

OOC: Fallinghero: oh? What if the captain releases me immediately?

OOC: Dreadweaver: anyways, stop the ic in ooc now

OOC: Qinetix: Take that to the IAA

OOC: Themodtester: But but YOU STARTED IT.

OOC: WestHybrid: The ic in ooc you brought up?

 

---

 

The OOC brought up is right here.

 

[DeletedUser]

 

Wait wait hold on... really? That OOC comment is all what this complaint is about?

 

Dread just commented that the SoP is a thing and that security disregarded it, its completely true, and he didn't punish anybody about it from what i understand, as the rules don't enforce following the SoP.

 

No really, tell me there is something more to this.

 

Is THIS:

 

OOC: Dreadweaver: whistles quietly

OOC: Dreadweaver: Security must respect the privacy of crew members and no unauthorized searches are allowed. Searches of any kind may only be done with a signed warrant by the Head of Security or higher, or if found with visible contraband.

OOC: Dreadweaver: Weapons worn by security/headstaff are to be hidden, except in emergencies.

OOC: Dreadweaver: continues whistling

OOC: Dreadweaver: I'd like to congratulate security for completely and UTTERLYdisregarding SOP in the last one hour

OOC: Dreadweaver: good job, guys.

OOC: Dreadweaver: anyways, stop the ic in ooc now

 

the point of this complaint?

 

[Sirhelgate]

 

He said more than just that, he continued talking at the round reset and at the start of the next lobby screen before he had to leave to his bus.

 

You now that I notice it, have the names of other people who were there that may be able to give you further information about everything that was being said. Since Icy snipped a very specific portion of the ooc conversation there.

 

[DeletedUser]

Just tell me this, is there anything specific you want to report, or just other Dreadweaver's comments that are the continuation of what was quoted above?

[Lucyz]

 

He said more than just that, he continued talking at the round reset and at the start of the next lobby screen before he had to leave to his bus.

 

You now that I notice it, have the names of other people who were there that may be able to give you further information about everything that was being said. Since Icy snipped a very specific portion of the ooc conversation there.

 

Yep and after Dreadweaver left Icy and some other players decided to talk behind his back and make sly remarks which I had to put a stop to, Unable to get the server logs from it seeing as it's not working for me currently but I just thought I'd add this here.

 

[Earthdivine]

As rude as that is, until the current complaint is resolved, please let's keep it on track and not list other complaints from other people or about other people, as that will clutter the topic and possibly cause more complications.

[Stephanov]

 

Continued screening is acceptable, however, at the alert status that they were at (Yes, I'm aware that the captain changed it without approval of the other heads), it was entirely against SOP to act upon suspicion for this type of behavior.

 

Actually it was announced that this was a screening on a volluntary basis, where nobody needed to actually show up if they didn't want to. (Especially since we de-escalated to green) Was more to rule out a few people rather than to hunt people down. It made sense in my character's eyes seeing he (as replacement HoS) showed up later in the shift.

 

--------------

 

As for procedures not being followed, hey if nobody complains to the HoS ICly instead of bawwing in LOOC/OOC I don't see how not both parties are partially to blame. Trained security officers are still people, and people make mistakes. Doesn't that seem fair enough?

 

 

Lastly, shouldn't one aim to diffuse uncomfortable situations in OOC rather than add fuel to the fire?

 

[IcyV]

Excuse me, Lucy? Yeah, I'd like some logs and proof of that. I don't recall making remarks about dread in OOC. I know others had their go, but I have my issues with him in private. It's rude as hell to call me out specifically if you're going to ignore the number of other people that say things much worse in public than I ever do.

[Earthdivine]

As rude as that is, until the current complaint is resolved, please let's keep it on track and not list other complaints from other people or about other people, as that will clutter the topic and possibly cause more complications.

[Sirhelgate]

 

Just tell me this, is there anything specific you want to report, or just other Dreadweaver's comments that are the continuation of what was quoted above?

 

just the general discourse, there were other comments he made about it after round end and at the start of the next round. I simply believe that he was angry because he was a person that the security looked into, and he decided to make uncalled for comments, then was generally passive aggressive. That's what this complaint is supposed to be about.

 

[DeletedUser]

 

Alright so I understand the mean comments coming from Dreadweaver is all this complaint is about.

 

He did not ban someone unjustly in relation to this incident, or abuse his authority to enforce a behaviour beneficial for his character.

 

He did not use admin powers to spawn hostle critters, spawn admin-weapons for himself, teleport himself away, delete players or map elements from the game, cripple players, start destructive events, or pushed any of the other 200 doom-device buttons on the admin panel.

 

He did express his annoyance at security ignoring the Standart Operating Protocol (which is arguable due to the circumstances) in the OOC chat in a passive-agressive manner, and could be accussed of breaking the "No IC in OOC" rule when doing so.

 

Is that correct?

 

If so, how would you expect the administration to act on this?

 

[Regen]

 

 

If so, how would you expect the administration to act on this?

 

I will talk to dread about keeping and maintaining his professionalism as an admin even when faced with aggravating situations such as this one

 

[DeletedUser]

 

I completely agree.

 

Anything else to add, or is the solution satisfying and the complaint can be marked as resolved?

 

EDIT: Dreadweaver has been talked to about his behaviour on this incident, and in general.

 

[Sirhelgate]

Thankyou, I'm satisfied with the solution. There's simply no need for admin to react that way to a struggling security team oocly, we've all been on plenty of rounds where things seemed to be completely sideways.

[Regen]

Complaint resolved