Kevak Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 So! I just played 23 straight hours. And out of the 17some rounds, there were 6 traitor/autotraitor. 3 traitorling, 1 nuke ops. 2 wizard. 1 vampire, 0 purechangeling, 0 cult, 2 vox raiders, and 1 shadowling. Methinks the ratio needs to be changed up. Maybe merging a few types into one. Traitor on its own is rather boring. Involves not much crew interaction and when it does, it involves murdering violently. Could be easily merged with other gamemodes. Traitors can coordinate with encryption keys but rarely do. This is already a midround spawn but it would be nice if one or two could triggerduring other rounds. Vampire is slightly more interesting but should prolly be merged with traitor rounds. Vampires have no way to identify one another and cannot coordinate. This should not be a separate round type. They're not really powerful enough to warrant a legitimate issue, and greytide vampireslayers gather rapidly quite often. Making vampires a midround spawn would be neat. Changeling is definitely more interesting of an antag. Can coordinate via hivemind. Can result in spider gamechanger spawning. Powerful enough to warrent a threat if coordinated. However they rarely coordinate, and they never coordinate when in traitorling rounds due to the lack of multiple lings. Making lings a midround spawn would also be neat. Pure changeling should just be merged. They are basically fancy traitors. Wizard could be fun if there wasn't validhunting. Seriously. Wizard exists purely to make rounds more fun via magic and drama. More of a performer then an antag. They should have peaceful objectives and they should not be Kill on Sight. It's not really possible to be nice to the crew as a wizard due to the whole Kill on Sight bit. Wizard could be merged with another roundtype or maybe done as a midround spawn. It's not enough as it is to warrant its own roundtype as of current. Shadowlings. They warrant their own roundtype. Although it would be fun to mix in xenos or cult. Antag group vs antag group tends to be quite fun. Nuke ops. They warrant their own roundtype but I personally think it would be neat if they were a midround spawn also. Dead players need more ways to enter the game. Maybe tweak the midround nukies to just steal stuff/assassinate/kidnap instead of nuke. Vox raiders could be a midround spawn or merged with another roundtype. They don't interact with enough of the crew to warrant a full round to themselves. And finally the best roundtype: Cult. Cult needs to be way more common. It involves the vast majority of the crew. However it's far too rare for anybody to get a grasp on it. Meaning that whenever we do get culties. Nobody knows what to do. The likelyhood of this and the likelyhood of pure traitor/vamp/changeling should be swapped in my vie. Thoughts? Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExGame Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 Mid-round antags? BAD idea, just BECAUSE they are picked from the ghost base, in example: Soon-to-be-nukeops-ghosts literally have a live tactical map of the whole map including where the Nuke Disk is, what the situation on the round is, how Command behaves, what the Captain is currently doing and they literally will have ALL of that information that normal start-round NukeOps don't have, which means they have a huge tactical advantange over the crew, same goes for other antags like Vox Raider, because they woudl have full knowledge where the ores/command/security and other stuff are which they could steal, some of theese things then again also can apply to other more stealthy antags. Merged antag rounds on start (antag vs. antag) sounds like a neat idea, but the whole mid-round antag idea is bad. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41864 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevak Posted October 11, 2015 Author Posted October 11, 2015 My thoughts behind the midround antags is they probably wouldn't have as much of an advantage as one would think. Ghosts in me experience tend to gather around something interesting and listen in or alt-tab out. They likely wouldn't know where the commandstaff went and the definitely wouldn't know where target items were. Ghosts can't see into backpacks or closed lockers. Yes they would have a slight advantage if they spent much of their death searching for specific things, but not really a major advantage. Probably would need a few tweaks for spawning the stealthy antags. Changelings could just be picked from new crew spawning, and lorewise, since vamps are basically bluespess entities possessing corpses, could have a corpse that someone is sitting in rez. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41866 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExGame Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 My thoughts behind the midround antags is they probably wouldn't have as much of an advantage as one would think. Ghosts in me experience tend to gather around something interesting and listen in or alt-tab out. They likely wouldn't know where the commandstaff went and the definitely wouldn't know where target items were. Ghosts can't see into backpacks or closed lockers. Yes they would have a slight advantage if they spent much of their death searching for specific things, but not really a major advantage. Probably would need a few tweaks for spawning the stealthy antags. Changelings could just be picked from new crew spawning, and lorewise, since vamps are basically bluespess entities possessing corpses, could have a corpse that someone is sitting in rez. That's what you may think, but Admins have a strict policy on that. In example, I accidently once typed ghost instead of give as a Traitor and were put back into my body 10 seconds and I got almost all of my objectives changed because I COULD have gone searching for him during that. You can not 100% say that the ghosts did not search for something, in which the Admins then are forced to assume that they have if you can't proove they didn't because they could have a major advantange by being ghosts, and if you talk abou tthoose alt-tab outted ghosts, what are they supposed to do if they are being picked as antags? Because they're basically just AFK, because there are lots of ghosts that are literally doing something else than playing and maybe just miss the whole round while they're picked as antags or something. You could say to now insert a "Join antag" box, but problem #1 would still exist. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41868 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevak Posted October 11, 2015 Author Posted October 11, 2015 Valid points. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41876 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Earthdivine Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 I got far more to say on this but I'll leave this here for now while I got Teamviewer running. Game Mode's weight's, in order from most likely to least. Auto Traitor Cult, Traitor-Changling Nuclear, Changling, Vampire Shadowling, Malf, Blob, Nuclear Ops, Extended, Wiznerd Heist Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41912 Share on other sites More sharing options...
ErinCrowe Posted October 11, 2015 Posted October 11, 2015 My thoughts behind the midround antags is they probably wouldn't have as much of an advantage as one would think. Ghosts in me experience tend to gather around something interesting and listen in or alt-tab out. They likely wouldn't know where the commandstaff went and the definitely wouldn't know where target items were. Ghosts can't see into backpacks or closed lockers. Yes they would have a slight advantage if they spent much of their death searching for specific things, but not really a major advantage. Probably would need a few tweaks for spawning the stealthy antags. Changelings could just be picked from new crew spawning, and lorewise, since vamps are basically bluespess entities possessing corpses, could have a corpse that someone is sitting in rez. That's what you may think, but Admins have a strict policy on that. In example, I accidently once typed ghost instead of give as a Traitor and were put back into my body 10 seconds and I got almost all of my objectives changed because I COULD have gone searching for him during that. You can not 100% say that the ghosts did not search for something, in which the Admins then are forced to assume that they have if you can't proove they didn't because they could have a major advantange by being ghosts, and if you talk abou tthoose alt-tab outted ghosts, what are they supposed to do if they are being picked as antags? Because they're basically just AFK, because there are lots of ghosts that are literally doing something else than playing and maybe just miss the whole round while they're picked as antags or something. You could say to now insert a "Join antag" box, but problem #1 would still exist. I think we should at least make cult more often and merge traders with something more stealthy which ends in boring rounds like traitor, have some of it crisscross between them like having to assassinate a vox trader or keep an abduction target on the station alive. Everyone knows what to do against cult but almost every cult fails because everyone is experienced against them while no cult members themselves know what to do. From my 3 failed cult rounds (which is the only antag I really ever want to be, my character is kind of infatuated with NarSie and cult sects) I know that is absolutely true. Nobody knows how to even remove runes or use them properly. Hell even I don't know how to use runes properly and it is my most common and favorite antag so far. I would give a lot to spawn with a cult paper every single round if I could just because it is the most interesting antag IMO. Usually all we ever get done is word research before we are all converted or killed by security. (or some asshole griefs the server and causes the shuttle to be called 5 minutes in like my third cult round.) Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41914 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted October 12, 2015 Posted October 12, 2015 I think we should at least make cult more often and merge traders with something more stealthy which ends in boring rounds like traitor, have some of it crisscross between them like having to assassinate a vox trader or keep an abduction target on the station alive. Vampires aren't very destructive. Vox + vampires? Could be interesting to see antag vs antag here. And then again, you've got stealthy vampire shitlords phasing through walls and stealing everything that isn't bolted. Would be interesting, actually... Vox in space, vampires can not into space! Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/5636-tweaks-to-likelyhood-of-different-roundtypesmerging/#findComment-41962 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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