Plotron Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Previously not only you had to bolt the airlocks (if you did not want to override the shuttle), but also all station shuttles had spin-up time, meaning that you would have some time to cancel the transfer and/or actively block it as AI. Now there's no such spin-up time, no delay, meaning faster travel, but also no cooldown between transfers. This means that you can buckle in and mash the buttons to stay in bluespace. Not sure how it works out in practice - is it possible to board the shuttle when it's popping in and out constantly? Either way, I think it was a stealthy feature removal; accidental or not, I think the current situation can be abused. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox McCloud Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 Not being able to delay the shuttle was very much intentional---it's not a 'feature' we wanted players to be able to do, as it generally winds up being used for...rather abusive purposes. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49690 Share on other sites More sharing options...
scrubmcnoob Posted December 29, 2015 Posted December 29, 2015 I'm glad you can't delay the shuttle anymore, that was annoying. When its time to leave, its time to leave. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49691 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted December 30, 2015 Author Posted December 30, 2015 (edited) I'm sorry for writing a confusing paragraph. I alluded to Bay's shuttle system, mentioning bolting airlocks and overriding, but in the topic it's clearly stated that I'm talking about small shuttles, not the emergency shuttle. I know it sounds similar; previously I had the guilty pleasure of breaking the controller (back when AI could access Escape airlocks) just to make sure a few latecomers boarded the ship in time. I'm not talking about this code weakness here, however. Not being able to delay the shuttle was very much intentional---it's not a 'feature' we wanted players to be able to do, as it generally winds up being used for...rather abusive purposes. As in - not letting an antag escape to camera-less Engineering Outpost via Engineering Shuttle by cancelling the bluespace engine spin-up process using the console on the station-side? Or malf AI "abusing" this feature when a handful of crew wanted to evacuate to Mining in the last seconds of the countdown but the AI had a camera and kept fucking with the console? You mean when you're going to Research Outpost and a coworker/friend catches up and wants to go with you, and you cancel the departure so he could get in? I've got a feeling you guys are talking about the Escape shuttle which the TG Shuttle System was meant to fully address and fix, and it was a success. I'm talking about the removed FEATURE (not an exploit) that prevented small shuttles from being launched instantly. Otherwise the small shuttle would depart the moment airlocks bolted. There was a big fat blue SPINNING UP shown on the console, so I guess it was intentional. Forget the airlock fuckery (override was a thing), it was a simple spin-up time that prevented these shuttles from being launched back again the instant they dock. As I said, all you need is to buckle-up and mash the buttons at the right time, but I'm unsure how hard it'd be to board the ship. There's probably some risk of spacing. At the very least a cooldown should be implemented. If we want to preserve current responsiveness, we could make it so that you only have to wait like 5-10 seconds after the shuttle's been used, giving people ample time to board it and robust the pilot for being a dick. What is more, it could be abused both ways - having the shuttle remotely called back immediately after docking offsite, so the pilot won't be able to leave. This is a never ending loop! You can't get to the pilot while he's in bluespace, duh! It's worse than if you were to ground him in the shuttle on the station. Edited December 30, 2015 by Guest Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49702 Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidchan Posted December 30, 2015 Posted December 30, 2015 -1 Got to be honest, the 'spin up' of Science and Mining shuttle being gone is a blessing. It was super annoying and didn't always work, at least once I know of a bug that would happen if the shuttle was canceled and forced at almost the same time that would duplicate the shuttle making it impossible to move them. If you want to stop the shuttle from being used, remove the console at the other end. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49705 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted December 30, 2015 Author Posted December 30, 2015 I know of a bug that would happen if the shuttle was canceled and forced at almost the same time that would duplicate the shuttle making it impossible to move them. Well, I've never experienced this bug, but it sure does sound gamebreaking. What were the steps to replicate it? Currently airlocks close/bolt/whatever right at the departure. Does "Force" button even make sense? If you want to stop the shuttle from being used, remove the console at the other end. What problem does it solve? Got to be honest, the 'spin up' of Science and Mining shuttle being gone is a blessing. Yes, it does feel nicer, I can give you that. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49707 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keroman Posted December 30, 2015 Posted December 30, 2015 As an AI during one shift I successfully prevented the kidnapping of an officer by repeatedly cancelling the science outpost shuttle until officers could get there and arrest the abductor. I'd be happy if we could add a short spin-up time to the outpost shuttles but leave the evac shuttle as it is now. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49714 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted December 30, 2015 Author Posted December 30, 2015 (edited) I just played with the Science shuttle. Did you know that you could change the destination IN-TRANSIT? This means that you can stay in Bluespace INDEFINITELY, as the destination change seems to reset the travel time. You may never arrive anywhere if you click once every 2 seconds. Edited December 30, 2015 by Guest Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49717 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigercat2000 Posted December 30, 2015 Posted December 30, 2015 I suggest making an issue report on the -tg-station github repo about that, Plotron. I'm not willing to make major changes to the shuttle system for the sake of keeping one of the shittier features of Bay shuttles- But being able to abuse the shuttles to stay in transit indefinitely is something I am sure the -tg- coders would like to prevent. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49718 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted December 30, 2015 Author Posted December 30, 2015 I'm not willing to make major changes to the shuttle system for the sake of keeping one of the shittier features of Bay shuttles Understandable. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49719 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Habalabam Posted December 30, 2015 Posted December 30, 2015 I did, about a week ago, when stepping aboard the mining shuttle, step into empty space because the shuttle disappeared exactly as I was moving onto the tile. I think that the shuttle should not leave before the outermost station door is bolted shut and it would require QM access level to press "override". Would this detail, if implemented, satisfy both sides in this thread? AI can withhold the shuttle by bolting a door open, but the potential for abuse would be limited. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49742 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Plotron Posted December 30, 2015 Author Posted December 30, 2015 I did, about a week ago, when stepping aboard the mining shuttle, step into empty space because the shuttle disappeared exactly as I was moving onto the tile. There appears to be no warning of any kind. I think that the shuttle should not leave before the outermost station door is bolted shut and it would require QM access level to press "override". Sounds almost like going back to Bay's system... Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6289-add-engine-spin-up-time-to-small-shuttles/#findComment-49753 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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