Security Holsters

[davidchan]

 

Because I am sick to death of this damn SoP argument about holsters. Create an alternative Holster for security gear and place it in the locker.

 

Security Holster: Attaches to jumpsuit as accessory. Can hold one Security Item (Taser, Stun Baton, Seclite, Flashbang, Flash, Pepperspray or Handcuffs. Possibly Stun Revolver) to allow concealable storage and quick retrieval with the press of a hotkey 'h'. Larger weapons can not be stored in a holster (E-Gun, Laser Rifle, Ion Carbine, ect...), nor can speciality weapons (Detectives Revolver, HoS Gun, Captain's Sidearm), as the holster is designed specifically for standard issue security gear.

 

Coding required: Minimal, duplicate Detective's holster, recode acceptable items list to what a Sec Belt can carry + Taser.

 

Spriting Required: Minimal, can clone Detectives Holster with reskin or ambitious spriter can make something new.\

 

Effected Roles: Security Officers, Warden, Head of Security, Security Pod Pilot.

 

Placement: Security holsters would be found inside Security Lockers (Security Equipment Room, Warden's Office, Head of Security's Office, Security Pod Pilot's hangar.)

 

[Belario]

 

I don't see why not, but it'd give officers yet another holding slot that's just a click away.

It's nothing they can't keep in their bag/armour slot anyway, might be a bit of a power creep (woe to the days of everyone carrying a half dozen flash bangs in their belt).

 

[saywat_the_15th]

The whole fucking "OMG SoP BREACH, YOUR TAZURR IS IN URRR ARMOR SLOT MEEHEHEHEH" is BS, this could prevent it if the armor slot would become the holster slot.

[Belario]

 

The whole fucking "OMG SoP BREACH, YOUR TAZURR IS IN URRR ARMOR SLOT MEEHEHEHEH"

People actually do that?

I don't believe it, I won't believe it!

That said if you're stuck with an asshat supervisor, it's not hard to keep it in your bag at code green though.

 

[LiquidNightfury]

 

The whole fucking "OMG SoP BREACH, YOUR TAZURR IS IN URRR ARMOR SLOT MEEHEHEHEH"

People actually do that?

I don't believe it, I won't believe it!

That said if you're stuck with an asshat supervisor, it's not hard to keep it in your bag at code green though.

 

I've been bitched at for it by civs and superiors more often than I have not.

 

[Mr. Anticitizen]

I've always had my taser in my armor pocket slot and have NEVER been bitched at.

[Keroman]

Same here, Anticitizen, although I've only been playing Sec for the last few weeks. I hadn't heard that anyone was making an issue of it until it was mentioned in the unique routines thread a few days ago.

[Fox McCloud]

Having your taser on your armor is not an SoP violation as far as I know; as far as I know, that refers purely to running around with your taser out.

[TullyBBurnalot]

 

As the person behind the current Sec SOP, no, it's not against Departmental Sec SOP to have tasers on your armor/belt/pocket/whatever.

 

Anyone who says otherwise is wrong and/or looking at outdated SOP.

 

[Regen]

 

Actually SOP says any visible weapons.

All threats to the station have passed. Security may not have weapons visible, privacy laws are once again fully enforced.

Which means all weapons you can see when you examine someone, which in turn means no weapons in your armor at all

 

[Keroman]

Then change the wording of the SOP to match what 99% of players view as being the correct interpretation. While we don't always try to match the in-game behaviors to real life it is very much true that in the vast majority of police forces which are issued sidearms - lethal or not - they are visible in a holster on the officer's person.

[Regen]

 

Actually SOP says any visible weapons.

All threats to the station have passed. Security may not have weapons visible, privacy laws are once again fully enforced.

Which means all weapons you can see when you examine someone, which in turn means no weapons in your armor at all

 

Going back to this, SOP has been updated to "All threats to the station have passed. All weapons need to be holstered and privacy laws are once again fully enforced."

 

[Plotron]

 

Only losers (or people playing on small screens) have their tasers on their armor slot. It's too far away for me from the center of the game area, and it's clearly visible upon examination.

Having my bag open makes for better quickdrawing and accuracy as I don't have to move my cursor sideways [to the left and right].

 

Security holsters. Hm.

Meh.

 

[davidchan]

 

Then change the wording of the SOP to match what 99% of players view as being the correct interpretation. While we don't always try to match the in-game behaviors to real life it is very much true that in the vast majority of police forces which are issued sidearms - lethal or not - they are visible in a holster on the officer's person.

 

If we went by that ruling, there would be no mis-use of evidence laws as any time a nuke op or traitor gets dunked their gear got looted by security. Beating people who resisted arrest into crit never would never had rules made against it and code green wouldn't even exsist since there isn't a regular security player who gives a shit what code is currently active, if they want to search your bag like a metagaming shit, you'll do it cooperatively or they'll taze and cuff you.

 

Actually SOP says any visible weapons.

All threats to the station have passed. Security may not have weapons visible, privacy laws are once again fully enforced.

Which means all weapons you can see when you examine someone, which in turn means no weapons in your armor at all

 

Going back to this, SOP has been updated to "All threats to the station have passed. All weapons need to be holstered and privacy laws are once again fully enforced."

 

The problem with that, armor =/= holster. A (law enforcement) holster protects the weapon from accidental discharge and prevent others from drawing the weapon to use against the owner). I.E. the clown banana/PDA slipping an officer, stripping their armor/exosuit slot and stealing the taser, compared to having to steal the entire bag or even take the jumpsuit off to get at the holster. Just saying that a specific slot counts as a holster for convenience is the 'we're too lazy to give a shit' route.

 

[Plotron]

 

I.E. the clown banana/PDA slipping an officer, stripping their armor/exosuit slot and stealing the taser, compared to having to steal the entire bag or even take the jumpsuit off to get at the holster. Just saying that a specific slot counts as a holster for convenience is the 'we're too lazy to give a shit' route.

Valid point, I'll use it from now on.

 

[Keroman]

 

If we went by that ruling, there would be no mis-use of evidence laws as any time a nuke op or traitor gets dunked their gear got looted by security. Beating people who resisted arrest into crit never would never had rules made against it and code green wouldn't even exsist since there isn't a regular security player who gives a shit what code is currently active, if they want to search your bag like a metagaming shit, you'll do it cooperatively or they'll taze and cuff you.

 

You don't need to put words in my mouth, man. I really hope that you understand that when I say the Server Rules and Space Law don't try to emulate real life exactly it's because I'm referring specifically to this conversation about the exosuit slot functioning as a holster or not. If you want to talk about those other rules or laws I'm all for it and we may agree or disagree on their wording or the need for them, but this conversation is solely about holsters for security. Trying to twist my words to fit completely seperate topics is just building a strawman and not productive for the thread at all.

 

A (law enforcement) holster protects the weapon from accidental discharge and prevent others from drawing the weapon to use against the owner). I.E. the clown banana/PDA slipping an officer, stripping their armor/exosuit slot and stealing the taser...

 

For starters the exosuit slot does prevent accidental discharge. If you're accidentally firing it while putting it into/taking it out of any slot you just need more experience at the game. I've been playing Security for like 3 weeks and haven't once accidentally fired the taser in the process of moving it around in my inventory/hand slots. I have accidentally fired it by clicking on dialog boxes that pop up or when switching windows from something else back to the game window, and that's entirely on me.

 

Also I would argue that the fact a clown can slip someone for long enough to take stuff off of them is less a problem with what items can be worn in what slots and more a problem with the length of time a slip off of a banana peel/PDA lasts. I understand that that's an important part of the FUN of playing clowns and nerfing that would make life more difficult for clown traitors, but isn't that what cuffs/cablecuffs/zipties are for, as well? To immobilize someone so you can remove their belongings with impunity? Ideally if a clown slips someone and can click the cuffs on them immediately there should be just enough time to cuff them, but not quite enough time to click-drag their sprite, find the appropriate slot, and click on it with enough time to successfully remove any items.

 

A Sec player being slipped by a clown needs to recognize that if the clown - or ANYONE - starts removing their stuff it's time to call for backup, and that sometimes backup just won't be available.

 

I honestly can't say that I've seen many non-antag clowns stealing items from Sec officers. Certainly I've had rounds where clowns are annoying as hell and even ganged up on people to slip them or drag them around in a box for a minute or two.

 

Now all this being said I'm actually in favor of adding holsters for Security Officers to hold their tasers in. It would be a nice quality-of-life improvement for them. But I don't think it's an immediate need and I don't think it should be necessary to use holsters to comply with SOP.

 

[Plotron]

 

If you want to talk about those other rules or laws I'm all for it and we may agree or disagree on their wording or the need for them, but this conversation is solely about holsters for security.

I agree, Davidchan went offtopic a little.

I honestly can't say that I've seen many non-antag clowns stealing items from Sec officers. Certainly I've had rounds where clowns are annoying as hell and even ganged up on people to slip them or drag them around in a box for a minute or two.

 

A better example would be a pickpocketer, emptying either the highly visible exosuit storage slot or the exosuit slot itself. The contents will land on the floor and be easily 'pocketable', if you pardon the pun. A backpack on the other hand would require the criminal to a) pick up the highly visible bag, b) occupy his second hand to check the contents and click the stuff they want, c) Ctrl+E the new item to put it in his own storage, d) likely throw away the new bag. That's more steps. Alternatively, he could simply click-drag the backpack on the floor to get to the contents faster, but it's arguably easier to lose the loot this way.

 

By carrying weapons on your armor you make it easier for people to rob you, because a) they know what you're carrying and b) there are less steps involved in taking it.

 

It's hypothetical, of course. Personally, I love putting the stunbaton on my belt slot for the convenience of quickdrawing and also to look more dangerous.