Fox McCloud Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 While I think the prize vendor is a great idea, I personally find it frustrating that the, mostly aesthetic, prizes that I can earn are pretty much gated by science doing their job (or not). This is particularly frustrating during slow/low pop shifts when you just want some minor goal to go for, but are incapable of doing so because science is nowhere to be found. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
necaladun Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 I see no reason for aesthetic prizes to rely on science at all. ...no idea what else is in that isn't aesthetic though. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58038 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keroman Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 I'm pretty sure that when the topic of adding tickets and a prize counter was first discussed that people were wondering why some of the prizes were locked behind science upgrades. I definitely agree that there's no real reason any prizes should be locked away, especially if they're harmless and for aesthetic purposes, and even if they're items that are intended to mimic antag stuff like the foam armblade or toy e-swords. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58039 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spacemanspark Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 It'd be nice if we also lowered the price for bikes while we are at it. It's almost impossible to get. [spoiler2]I'm still salty nobody told me they removed the noise from the toy chainsaws.[/spoiler2] Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidchan Posted March 5, 2016 Posted March 5, 2016 +1 No idea why science is needed for this. Should be reversed, science able to fix the machine to lower the price/increase prize redemption rate. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58046 Share on other sites More sharing options...
FalseIncarnate Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 I made it gated behind upgrades for a couple very simple reasons. 1. The prize costs are all rather low, meaning a couple games should be plenty to win nearly any prize you want (with the exception being the bike). The gating helped keep the prizes "limited" in the sense that the higher tier prizes would remain more uncommon at least early into the shift. This would give a sense of progression across the round (in theory) by having more prizes become available as time goes on. In practice, this doesn't tend to be the case because science rarely does progressive upgrades and instead opts for "all or nothing" upgrades. 2. The prize costs were entirely made up and admittedly total BS. As it stands, they are all on the low side, which means a discounted price from upgrades would end up with things costing laughably low amounts and a single game being able to win you multiple prizes. While discounts were something I had considered, I still was unsure of it and felt the "gating" would give science a better incentive to actually upgrade the machine (for new toys / to appease the angry masses bashing in their windows). As for the comments about the bike... that's the point. Go to nearly any arcade and you will see some sort of "grand prize" (typically hanging from the ceiling / top shelf) that costs a seemingly absurd number of tickets, typically in the thousands. The cliche standard grand arcade prize is some cool looking bike, costing upwards of 50,000 tickets easily. When you actually do the math, you actually will typically end up putting more money into the machines than that prize is probably worth, which is how arcades really make the money. The in-game prize counter has the bike set at a similarly high price for the reason of giving people a (typically unobtainable) goal to aspire to, and as a homage to real-life arcades and their grand prizes. The bike costs 10,000 tickets (exactly 1 full stack + 1 ticket) and is meant to be the ultimate tease. (Fun fact: I nearly made the bike completely non-functional / a model bike to be a major troll. Luckily, I decided to actually put a little effort in to make it ride-able.) In summary, I agree that the upgrade-locks are not ideal. If there were a better way of doing things, I'd be open to suggestions on the matter. However, I didn't lock it simply for the sake of being able to do so, I just couldn't think of a better (yet balanced and fair) way of making upgraded parts matter. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58103 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lolzyking Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 False is the new fun police, Fox is now a nice guy Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58108 Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidchan Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 @False, while I understand the desire to give science an incentive to be able to upgrade the machine (more station upgrades from RnD will have a +1 from unless they do something really bad.) I think you went the wrong end with the science upgrades. Everything in currently the machine should be unlocked by default, with a higher price. Science upgrades should bring the prices down based upon tier of parts inside of them. I'm also a bit disappointed there isn't some tie to actual research levels. Once RnD is done (and sync'd) to a certain point, gimmick items should be purchasable from the prize vendor. Nightvision goggles for example would be something pretty cool that could be bought with tickets. Magboots, pAIs or even something like the Janitor's Mop as a gag gift. Plastic Teleshields could be entertaining too (don't actually block melee attacks, but block hugs!) Really, the Bluespace Wormhole Device (Portal Gun) should be removed from the protolathe and added to the prize machine as the Ultimate Grand Prize for people to try and earn after RnD did it's job. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58117 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrat Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 I don't agree with it giving out R and D items. They're science-made for a reason, usually given to those that actually need them. And OH HELL NAW for you being able to win the portal gun. It's lockboxed to the RD because it is just so easily abused since you can break into any place with a window in a few seconds. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58144 Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidchan Posted March 6, 2016 Posted March 6, 2016 1) Night Vision goggles aren't unique to RnD, some locations have them by default, such as Tcomm and the Derelict, and I'm quite certain I found a set while mining. I also only suggested Nightvision goggles, not Huds or department specific gear. Several other items exist that would make decent prizes or gimmicky toys to be handed out. Plus if they can be acquired without having to pester RnD, all the better, particularly in cases where mining isn't active. 2) The Portal Gun is a gimmick that really doesn't belong in RnD, and gating it behind the Prize Machine would make it even rarer considering it would require an obscene amount of tickets AND research to be accomplished. You can play the arcade machines for over an hour and still not have the 10,000 tickets for a bike, if the PG was even more expensive it'd require several players working together to buy. Link to comment https://www.paradisestation.org/forum/topic/6855-make-prize-vendors-start-with-all-prizes/#findComment-58150 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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