Lock boxes 2 electric boogaloo

[pipextiny]

 

Well the first thing I need to say is what should get put in lock boxes:

All of the mech guns (at a stretch unlock non lethal weapons)

Both of the Implants science get (freedom & adrenaline)

security huds (both on face and cybernetic)

 

You want to know why?

 

Mech guns= First off Randy Roboticist should not get access to guns, fairly standard stuff right? There is no situation where robotics or any other member of the science department should need one and if they need one so badly they should ask the captain or HoS not just slap it on there themselves. If they are antags they can one just get a emag or two just get a ID off someone who can after the put a little more effort in then they can go on a mass shooting or what ever they need to do.

 

Implants= For a start these where antag items so Its safe too say they are fairly good at doing things you are not supposed to doing . So after you get arrested for a legitimate crime you can just pop the cuffs off with a click of a button then run off if they stun you just pop the adrenaline and leg it down the hallway what is going to stop you? TL;DR :n fuck sec lel

 

Huds = First off they are sec huds not Samantha Scientist's huds and I'm just fed up with getting set to arrest then just taking themselves off like they never did anything in the first place

 

Long story short its dumb this sort of stuff should be left to sec (or snacky beacky angtags)

 

[NTSAM]

 

I'd be up for SecHuds being removed from science altogether and just moving them to Cargo and locking them to security access tbh

 

It's quite literally the cheapest shot ever.

 

[sdtwbaj]

 

No, no, and maybe.

 

Robotics are usually told to make something. If the HoS or Captain has to come down and babysit, you ruin any chance at them actually doing shit.

 

Implants that are given are illegal, thus there isn't much of an IC reason they'd be lock boxed because they're illegal research that nanotrasen doesn't support.

 

Huds, possibly.

 

[pipextiny]

 

I'd be up for SecHuds being removed from science altogether and just moving them to Cargo and locking them to security access tbh

 

It's quite literally the cheapest shot ever.

 

What about NV huds and hud cybernetics?

 

[NTSAM]

fuck nvs/cybernetics you can wear glasses and a flashilght >

[Spacemanspark]

 

It really doesn't make sense that science's stuff is lockboxed, but yet robotic's stuff isn't...

Why should robotics get access to LMGs, tasers, ion rifles, etc., and in a giant armored deathmech too?

 

[sdtwbaj]

 

It really doesn't make sense that science's stuff is lockboxed, but yet robotic's stuff isn't...

Why should robotics get access to LMGs, tasers, ion rifles, etc., and in a giant armored deathmech too?

death mechs are ID locked aren't they?

 

[Spacemanspark]

 

It really doesn't make sense that science's stuff is lockboxed, but yet robotic's stuff isn't...

Why should robotics get access to LMGs, tasers, ion rifles, etc., and in a giant armored deathmech too?

death mechs are ID locked aren't they?

No.

Otherwise I wouldn't complain.

 

[Regen]

 

It really doesn't make sense that science's stuff is lockboxed, but yet robotic's stuff isn't...

Why should robotics get access to LMGs, tasers, ion rifles, etc., and in a giant armored deathmech too?

death mechs are ID locked aren't they?

No.

Otherwise I wouldn't complain.

Because, according to fox, a mech is much more visible, and can't be hidden, if a traitor uses a mech everyone will instantly know because they'd have to emag the lockboxes open

 

[Coldflame]

 

you don't need to hide a mech

 

you're inside a fucking mech with LMGS and a missile rack

 

[Regen]

And you get fucked by literally 3 ion shots

[pipextiny]

 

Because, according to fox, a mech is much more visible, and can't be hidden, if a traitor uses a mech everyone will instantly know because they'd have to emag the lockboxes open

 

So because people can identify that the person inside is a antag that is a good reason not to have them lock boxed?

Death mechs should be used to go loud, as fox says they are much more visible. They are not supposed to hide the fact they are a traitor because at that point you are going out with a bang anyway

 

[Kyet]

 

Lockboxes are lazy, unrealistic, and inconsistent.

 

They're lazy because "lock em up" is the standard approach to anything people don't want to deal with. Item OP? Lock it up. Clown being annoying? Lock em up. Can't be bothered to carry the nuke disk around with you? Lock it up. Same with everything. It is the go-to lazy solution for every problem.

 

They're unrealistic because they're more secure than the vault, or the Captain's personal safe. The only ways in are authorized ID, or emag. Anyone with tools can break into the vault, or Captain's safe, but a simple lockbox? Good luck. Science items should not be held to a higher security standard than the items in the station's high security vault. That's just ridiculous. The fact that lockboxes exist at all in their current format is an obvious rule patch to make certain items harder to get, even though it makes no sense in-universe. Scientists are capable of hacking their devices to produce all sorts of crazy things, but in-universe, they can't make items materialize without a lockbox on them? Even when they, presumably, researched and input the design themselves? Silly.

 

They're inconsistent because their application seems to be driven by salt, rather than any sort of coherent rule or principle. Bags of Holding are not lockboxed, despite being one of the most dangerous R&D items, historically prone to creating unwanted singularities in the middle of science. RSGs are not lockboxed, despite being able to create mixes which instantstun+silence, cause death in 24 seconds from one shot, and cause death in 30 seconds whilst dusting the body and preventing cloning with one hit. RSGs are perhaps THE most dangerous weapon in science, yet they're almost unique amongst the R&D weapons because they're NOT lockboxed. Even stun revolvers ARE lockboxed, despite almost identical tasers in the armory not being lockboxed. Loyalty implants are lockboxed, even when placed in the armory, and only accessible to security, and having no bad use that I can think of. Chem implants, however, despite having very horrific uses, and being placed right next to the lockboxed loyalty implants, are NOT lockboxed.

There is no consistency as to what is, and what is not, lockboxed. No consistency at all.

Whether an item is lockboxed or not seems to be driven entirely by how much salt people pour on it in the forums.

Fear leads to hate, hate leads to the dark side, the dark side leads to lockboxing?

 

Why would blatently illegal tech be spawned in a lockbox? If you're making something you KNOW is illegal in-universe... why would you program the design with a lockbox? To turn your potentially useful item into an incriminating box you probably can't open, and which leaves further evidence of your deeds behind even if you do open it? Makes no sense.

 

Why do sec HUDs not check your ID before allowing you to change arrest statuses? Let everyone wear sec huds - they're useful for identifying jobs and people you should stay away from - but only let security / etc change arrest status. It is silly and inconsistent that sec terminals require a sec ID to view/change info that a sec hud lets you view/change with no authorization check whatsoever. No consistency.

 

I don't understand the hate for mechs.

If an antag wants to use a mech, they have emags, so lockboxes won't stop them.

If a non-antag is using a mech, they're probably harmless. If they attack anyone, or wreck the station, they can be banned for self-antagging, so its unlikely they'll do these things. What's the problem with someone having a combat mech if they can't use it to hurt anyone or wreck anything? What are they gonna do, walk around and look real scary? They're a paper tiger! At any point, sec/command can decide to destroy their mech, and arguably they can't even fight back to defend themselves without being accused of self-antagging. You can literally laser their mech to pieces with them in it, and they can't lift a finger to defend themselves. The most they can do is run away, but you have the AI to bolt doors for you, and they're usually very slow even with doors open. How, exactly, are these slow-moving, too-loud-to-be-stealthy mechs, who can't fire back, and can often have their location tracked at all times, giving you trouble?

 

[ProperPants]

 

inb4 someone ignores tzo

 

I agree with everything you said, though. What would be a lot more interesting than lockboxes is a moderate map redesign to include security checkpoints in high-risk/vulnerable departments (Science and Engineering really. Maybe Medical). Metastation has these checkpoints, and the plasma station away mission does too. I've always found these charming, but never get to see them being used. They also seem quite useful and practical - just have security search anyone suspicious coming in and out, and have them monitor what is given to whom.

 

[Regen]

 

inb4 someone ignores tzo

 

I agree with everything you said, though. What would be a lot more interesting than lockboxes is a moderate map redesign to include security checkpoints in high-risk/vulnerable departments (Science and Engineering really. Maybe Medical). Metastation has these checkpoints, and the plasma station away mission does too. I've always found these charming, but never get to see them being used. They also seem quite useful and practical - just have security search anyone suspicious coming in and out, and have them monitor what is given to whom.

Having security micromanaging shit seems like a horrible idea, and just serves to get them even more hated

 

[davidchan]

 

Lockboxes are the cancer of Science, stop trying to add more of them.

 

On that topic remove Toxins access from HoS so he can't print himself guns anymore.

 

[Coldflame]

 

Lockboxes are the cancer of Science, stop trying to add more of them.

 

On that topic remove Toxins access from HoS so he can't print himself guns anymore.

HoS can't print anything with their default access

 

Captain is the one person on the station who can print and unlock weapons without ID changes or a second person.

 

[pinatacolada]

I thought you could crack lockboxes with emmiters, the same way you do with crates.

[Coldflame]

 

I thought you could crack lockboxes with emmiters, the same way you do with crates.

 

I'm 90% sure lockboxes are tamper-proof short of an emag

 

[Keroman]

 

If an antag wants to use a mech, they have emags, so lockboxes won't stop them.

 

Except I've seen changelings and vampires use mechs to go on a rampage pretty damn consistently and neither of those have access to an emag.

 

It really does seem that when Robotics ignores SOP and starts building combat mechs a rampage is inevitable. Ever since the SOP update I have seen Robotics ask for authorization twice and one of those times they actually managed to deliver 2 or 3 Durands to security.

 

What happens more often is that someone who actually IS concerned with SOP spots a Durand or Gygax chassis in Robotics and asks the HoS or Captain if they authorized it. HoS and Cap say no and it's not red alert so someone from swings by and confiscates the half-finished mechs. Now Roboticists are pouty because "whats SOP shitcurity stealin muh mechs" which means security doesn't get any mechs at all that round through no fault of their own.

 

At least by putting the weapons in lockboxes (much like the weapons you can make from the protolathe) the Roboticist can hand over the mech and the lockboxes separately and the Warden or HoS can slap the weapons on once they get to mech to the brig.

 

I thought you could crack lockboxes with emmiters, the same way you do with crates.

 

Nope, they're ID-locked to Armory access, but an emag will get them open. Nothing else works. I would honestly be in favor of allowing other means to open them. Emitter, EMP, that sort of stuff.

 

[pipextiny]

 

Ok how about we add the shit I said to lock boxes BUT we change the way lock boxes work so they can be broken in too like every other locked thing in the game. Not to say they should be easy to get in to but you don't need just a emag or access to get in

 

Any one up for that?

 

[Lolzyking]

Maybe if during an emergency the Ai or someone with captain/hos access could turn off lock boxes.

[HereticChurch]

If we give people a way to get into lockboxes outside of armory access + emags, it will happen literally every round. The new meta will be to get whatever is needed to unlock the lockboxes to science and just open everything, so lockboxes will be absolutely worthless. The balance of the game would tip back to science being a self sufficient fortress of gun toting validhunting powergamers.

[TullyBBurnalot]

 

I legitimately hate to be "that guy", but lockboxes are necessary, even if they are an Obvious Rule Patch.

 

Why?

 

Because if they weren't there, Science would immediately go back to Pre-Lockbox days. IE, research up, guns ahoy, suddenly Science is the single most militarized department on the station and the RD is carrying an Armory in their BoH. And regardless of what any of you might say, there is literally no reason for this to happen unless everything has gone to shit and Security have all died and half the station is blown up.

 

Honestly, a better solution would be to just ID-Lock combat Mechs, kinda like the Durand in the Gamma Armory. I would absolutely not mind having to go grab the Mech myself if it meant Shitboticists are permanently locked out of something they have literally no reason to be using in the first place.

 

And in regards for "But if what if literally everything went wrong" circumstances, maybe make it so that there's a "Remove ID Restrictions" thing that Command can swipe for? So that if yes, everything just went wrong, anyone can hop into a Mech and try to solve the problem.

 

[Coldflame]

lockboxes wouldn't need to be a thing if RD players were competent