Magistrate/Judge should not cost karma.

[uliks]

 

Magistrate should be very important job and allways be there in every round, game is yust feeling empty if you can not talk and exsplain your actions with someone, talking with NT and then talking with admins, is so boring and slow and it ruining the role play of all this community. Trust me! I mean it is not the same. But things in the curt are much more fun.

 

Please make curt and judge and lawyers that every ciminal should enyoy this game.

 

and not like: YES, WE FOUND A VAMPIRE, QUICKLY TO CREMATORIUM, LETS BURN THE MOTHER FUCKER DOWN RIGHT NOW. !!! BURN !!BURN !! BURNN!!

 

Edited April 24, 2016 by Guest

[isaac]

Problem is the magistrate is the job that needs the most experience with spesslaw and RP otherwise it devolves into bwoink city. Do you want commander greyshit to be in that position? Granted you do never see magistrates. Maybe instead of karma it is locked behind a long playtime lock?

[saywat_the_15th]

That job has so much power, it has to be karma locked.

[NTSAM]

 

I never have seen a great trial. I don't think I've even seen trials, nor do I think there's anywhere even stating people can have one.

 

 

Now, listen, this guy basically gets to control the flow of briggings, executions, and perma-ing, okay? It's locked because it requires you to RP well and it's locked because you really shouldn't let Bill McGreytider be one until you know you can trust him.

 

If anything, keeping it locked helps out the RP, so you don't get a shit bald magistrate who executes people for breaking an out-of-the-way window in maint to make room for their maint fort 100% of the time.

 

 

And personally, I don't think more magistrates would end sec murderbones, I believe they'd just kill the antags on the spot rather than killing them in the brig. Plus, Vampires are really, really hard to contain, especially so if they've sucked up enough blood. It's usually your only and best choice to execute them as they'll just mist form their way out 80% of the time.

 

Edited April 24, 2016 by Guest

[Sothangel]

I don't see any reason why it should not cost karma. A bad magistrate can just obstruct and hamper security and potentially ruin rounds for either side. The final word in law shouldn't be available for anyone. Besides, if it wasn't for the karma lock, anyone could ask the hop to become the magistrate. That wouldn't be fun.

[nickcrazy]

No.

[Farya]

 

Magistrate is the most expensive Karma job for reason. Good magistrate can improve round to best. Bad magistarte WILL make the round shitty.

And we have free Internal Affairs agents. Pick one and make sure the SOP and the law is followed as one. If shitcurity ignoring you - make a complaint to non-comdom captain, NT rep or send a good fax to CC.

 

[uliks]

 

but lets say you where in same situation like i was.

 

One time i burned Pun-pun with syring and bartender took Pun-pun to medbey, Pun-pun survived. He reported me to HoS i was arrest and gone permabrig, later i asked admin why i was in perma and he told me that HoS heard i was planing to atack bartender. I was in permabrig with no good reason i could not even make meet up with IA.

 

Second time, i was attacking with syringe one guy and bruning him, he was dressed full like syndicate, and mask and with no ID, unknown and he was runing around the maintance dragin a body. And also i was arrested and perma briged.

 

Some times you can be in perma brig with no good reason and you can not even exsplain anybody what happend and there is no vaild IA who can make something happend, and if it does, it takes prety long time for you. My brig timer runs out before he find a way to get me out, what realy sucks.

 

I saw few rounds with a Magistrate going Judge in Holodec door and calling lavyer and vitnes, it is posible to make room yust like that, and it was realy nice. I would realy wish that happend more often, and i would realy like to see that every round for every criminal.

 

[saywat_the_15th]

 

I would realy wish that happend more often, and i would realy like to see that every round for every criminal.

 

I have seen couple of proper trials, the thing with those is that they are a such a pain in the ass to try to organize. You need the magistrate, HoS, people involved in the case, detective to present evidence, lawyer. If there is a situation when there for example is a traitor that has been caught and is about to be trialed, it is almost quaranteed that other traitors are raising hell somewhere else. Trials are a hassle. And also, trials are reserved for people who have committed capital crimes.

 

If you are being perma'd or executed for legit no reason and trying to sort it out IC is not working, you can always Ahelp it.

 

[uliks]

Like the point of game is looseing or wining, i dont care if some triators will murderbone everyone. Why are you all acting like you play this game for win. Why are you all acting like you never played any antag, this game is for fun and you will be traitor to one day.

[NTSAM]

No one really implied it was about losing or winning?

[SkyPing]

Magistrate is a role that is unique to paradise station. No other server has them and they work just fine. However, sec is taken pretty seriously, and people CAN and WILL get job banned from it if they mess up SoP. Ahelp if situations like those happen again, or file a player complaint.

[Dumbdumn5]

 

Karma locks on jobs are there to allow somebody that is hopefully more competent and reasonable to be placed in a position that is believed to hold more roleplay intense situations, such as NT Reps, Magistrates, and the Blueshield, while some are for more recreation or off-hand jobs that add a bit of spice to the game without being wholly necessary, such as barber and mechanic.

 

Stripping away the karma lock from magistrate would allow for more players to experience that kind of role, and it's understandable to think that we could have people adjust to that position of power. This is most prevalent in the captain role. Some players play captain regularly, and often times grow through the process of the job, learning what makes a good and a bad captain and how to avoid becoming the latter. However, like a captain, for every good captain, there's going to be at least a handful of mediocre or outright bad captains to take their place. This isn't to say it's impossible for there to be any kind of balance of power, but abuse potential is something we really have to look out for. The Magistrate goes above everybody except for CC(Admins), including the captain and the HoS, meaning that this position is especially prone to people who are known for being metafriendy or just in a bad mood. Sure, we could dish out more job bans for it, but our goal as admins isn't to toss out bans or babysit certain positions because they're being abused or have the potential to be abused. We're here to make sure the game runs smoothly and enjoyably.

 

In terms of the current process being slow, I can connect with you on that point. I've gone through the process as a player before, and it either got a response within ten minutes, or got completely ignored and passed up for the entire round. Communication with CC over issues can be one of the most frustrating parts about Roleplay simply because it relies on admin rank, availability, and the drive of the admin behind it. There can be plenty of different responses to one question depending on who gets the the fax panel first, and sometimes that makes it hard for admins to send a fax back, mainly due to how they're either too busy to be bothered, or because they think somebody else might have grabbed it, and don't want to step on any toes.

 

I can't say removing the karma lock will fix any of the problems you hope for, mostly because trials are almost unheard of, most of the arguing is done in processing, making trials close to obsolete due to the essentials of a trial environment being incorporated into the arrest if security is doing well.

 

In short, I can't support how this is currently, not because I completely disagree with the concept you're shooting for, but because I don't think this will fix the problems you think it will.

 

[Fox McCloud]

 

Magistrate isn't going to become a "free" job---just not going to happen.

 

 

Reason there's not many trials is because people want to turn them into mega drama-fests, and string them out for forever----and most of the time the crime that the person committed is fairly obvious and warrants a sentence that's fairly clear cut (this is even more so, on our server, due to the restrictions on antags and what we do or do not define as 'self-antagging.').

 

There have been trials, but when they generally happen, they dominate most of security's time and invariably the defense attorney and prosecutor spend insane amounts of time arguing to the point that....generally speaking, most trials end up lasting 1+ hours.

 

[Cupcakes_n_Hacksaws]

Everybody here saying it should remain locked because it's such a huge responsiblity and shouldn't be allowed to greytiders because of the power they have... but what about the fucking captain? All access, can do whatever the fuck he wants basically...

[Farya]

 

Everybody here saying it should remain locked because it's such a huge responsiblity and shouldn't be allowed to greytiders because of the power they have... but what about the fucking captain? All access, can do whatever the fuck he wants basically...

Karma jobs not only usually powerful but also not mandatory one. Station can live without magistrate but any crisis without good captain could be dire for station. Magistrate also also have weighter word in law questions that comdom. Captain cant outrule him.

 

[uliks]

 

Captain is very important role and some times we got bad captain, and all station go to hell, and still captain dont cost no Karma, and nobody cares about becouse there is still way that everybody agree and rumuve the captain from that game ( and i am not talking about CC/Admins) and that problem can still be fixed and games countine to be fun.

 

BUT...some time we have bad secuirty who arrest random civilans for random crimes, and do as they please... like i told you in privous exsamples...and then i must call ADMIN and that is for me disgrace for role play.

 

[necaladun]

 

This simply isn't happening.

 

If security are being shit, a magistrate isn't the solution here. You have a HoS, Captain, IAA, and admins, to prevent this. A magistrate is not required, nor intended, to stop security arresting random people for non-crimes. They can do it sure, but that's not their primary purpose.

 

[uliks]

Some times you dont have: Secuirty, HoS, Captain, IAA, or admins to hear your needs, thats why this game needs in my opinion " Judge with a small curt" And not yust becouse it will help stop people beaing rage against shitcurity, IT is becouse it is fun thing to have in this game.

[necaladun]

If the magistrate is not karma locked, then it won't be able to be relied upon anywhere near as much as it is now, as it might just be a greytider in a wig. If everyone else isn't listening or doing the right thing, then there's no reason the magistrate will. If there are no admins available, then having anyone able to play the magistrate will just make things worse.

[Renomaki]

 

Honestly, just because there is no magistrate, it doesn't mean there is no way to get security to stop being shitcurity.

 

If your HoS isn't pretending to be a security officer with more access, you could try to contact him and discuss whatever problems you are having with an officer that might have abused you, and he SHOULD fix the problem if he cares about the station.

 

If the HoS is a douche, then you can go to the captain and talk to him about it, and he'll probably do something about it to avoid making himself look like a condom.. I know I wouldn't want to be called a condom, so damn right I'd do something about it to get my officers back in line if my HoS won't do it.

 

And if that fails, you can contact an IAA or maybe even the NT rep and have them send a fax discussing the issue at hand, and hope that CC gets the message across to stop acting like idiots and get back in line.

 

.. And if that fails, you are shit outta luck.

 

[Doukan]

 

If the AI hasn't made it their mission to be the station's supercop you can always try getting it to help you out, I've been rescued from securitrash more than once by a nice AI.

That said though the unfortunate recent trend with AI players seems to be to talk nigh exclusively on command/sec comms and support their actions no matter what, if you get the occasional decent AI that actually knows it's their job to help everyone and not just the redshirts though you can go far.