Does space lube REALLY need to exist?

[ZN23X]

I ask because the majority of the time I see anyone using space lube, it's just some power gamer taking advantage of every mechanic of the game they can to get the upper hand in combat. Oh and OCCASIONALLY a prank from the clown or mime, but mostly used as a lethal weapon by antags who would probably instantly cry to an admin about me using excessive force if I disabled them with lethals even though I have no way of reaching them due to thier shittery. I should try have to carry around a crow bar, floor tiles, or a spray bottle with drying agent as security. A greytide antag shouldn't feel more dangerous to me than a nuclear operative.

Back to the initial question though, does is actually serve a function like for engineering or is its sole purpose for slipping people, and mostly only utilized by the worst people on the server who are eventually gonna get perma banned for pushing too far too much anyways? 

This is why we can't have nice things ?

Full discourse, I work sec 99% of the time  (quite literally) so obviously my experience with space lube is bias from that perspective. I'm sure people who just screw around every match till they roll antag love it...also if a chemist can please deliver me a bucket of salt ASAP I'd love it, cuz I need it ?

Edited March 13, 2017 by ZN23X

[davidchan]

It's been in the game for years, so that is part of why it is exists still. The other part is being that it just water+ in terms of slipping, harder to acquire and more effective but similar in function. Antags and Non-antags alike can use it (chemists love to use it against nukes) as a non-lethal self defense item.

It's also part of the few chems that interact with IPCs as drugs for them.

[Birdtalon]

Sounds very much to me that you got slipped and died a little while before making this post. You've offered no real compelling reason to remove it in my mind other than you dislike it. Maybe we should remove all tools from antagonists because some people dislike a diverse way of playing.

[ZN23X]

  On 3/13/2017 at 11:44 AM, Birdtalon said:

Sounds very much to me that you got slipped and died a little while before making this post. You've offered no real compelling reason to remove it in my mind other than you dislike it. Maybe we should remove all tools from antagonists because some people dislike a diverse way of playing.

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The reason I've offered is because it is mostly just abused by powergamers. If powergamers didn't abuse it I wouldn't even be bringing this up. Same reason they had to add a cool down to the rest command, so power gamers could stop pretending they are Neo dodging bullets. I haven't been killed by it that I can recall...maybe once. This isn't some random rage post after a match, this is something I've thought about over time after multiple matches experiencing people using it. I've just only seen it abused by chucklefuck antags and greytide. Maybe make it so the duration of space lube is shortened? Make it so you CAN actually walk on space lubed floors withoit slipping? I don't know.

[Birdtalon]

You can counter space-lube fairly easily by crow barring up the floor tiles. It isn't like there is no counter play against it.

[ZN23X]

  On 3/13/2017 at 1:59 PM, Birdtalon said:

You can counter space-lube fairly easily by crow barring up the floor tiles. It isn't like there is no counter play against it.

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Doesn't work in maint or other places you can't pull up the floor. The exact places powergamers will lure you to to take advantage of the lube because, again, they are powergamers and they will literally take advantage of every mechanic of the game to gain an edge. They know exactly where to spray lube in order to make sure I slip into a disposal and go through an endless carousel trying to get to them. Again, I shouldn't have to carry around a crow bar, floor tiles (cuz ya I could technically lie down tiles in maint as opposed to cross barring them up and we can get in an epic battle of me putting down and removing tiles over and over till they run out of lube), and/or drying agent to counter this (the riveting battle of them wetting the floor and me drying it till both our bottles run emtpy!) 

Or maybe just I'll let lethally injure anyone who uses it in this fashion cuz it's the easiest way I can stop them and wait till *I* get yelled at for it, cuz that's a counter...I won't kill em, just hurt em enough so they require medical attention before they die. Then I'll get perma brigged and possibly job banned for attempted murder and they'll get to chucklefuck the rest of the round after possibly serving a work place hazard sentence, but only after they spend more time than they'd serve in the cell arguing why they shouldn't be sentenced.

And I promise you the people who abuse the lube will cry to the admins immediately if I step out of bounds. Break and take advantage of every rule as far as they can to the edge. Makes the game fun for everyone  (which is actually an antags job, not just to be as much of an a-hole as possible so they can laugh thier zits off).

Plus side is these people usually get perma banned at some point for pushing it too far too much. There is solace in that.

Edited March 13, 2017 by ZN23X

[ZN23X]

Screw it though...you are right. I am just salty Shitcurity and we need to give power gaming antags and greytide as much of an advantage as possible because they are the good guys. Hell let's get rid of the rest command cool down while we are at it cuz dodging lasers and tasers is fun. Get rid of any other restraints they've put in place to prevent power gaming. Restrictions are unecessary and only lead to ruining everyones fun.

I'm done, I've vented. This post won't change anything. I'll suck it up n deal with it like I have to with the rest of the power gaming antics. In a way it drives me, so bring it

Edited March 13, 2017 by ZN23X

[Birdtalon]

Using mechanics to gain an advantage over other players. That just sounds to me like a competitive video game. I don't understand the use of the word powergaming about any mechanic that gains an advantage over others, all it does is dilute the word. At the end of the day why should antagonists be forced to play a fair game, this isn't chess. And there is a difference between someone who is going of of their way to be a shitter and someone who uses space lube. They are not one and the same.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Birdtalon

[ZN23X]

Work sec more and you'll get to see alot of people treating this like a competitive video game. View my Tales from Shitcurity post if you need examples lol

Edited March 13, 2017 by ZN23X

[Birdtalon]

I've played plenty of security.

Edited March 13, 2017 by Birdtalon

[ZN23X]

I surrender lol

GREEN TEXT

[Tayswift]

I agree. Space lube is basically a shorter range multi-tile taser with a lot of ammo that can stun multiple people. The problem with it isn't that it can be helpful to antags, it's that the only reason it's ever used is because it's such a great weapon, rather than having any intrinsic RP value of its own. This is NOT a competitive video game. Unfortunately, there is a ton of focus in this server, even from some admins, on being "good" at the game, so it sort of results in an arms race between antags and security, leading to absurd scenarios like security having to carry around a crowbar and floor tiles.

[ZN23X]

  On 3/15/2017 at 10:06 AM, Tayswift said:

This is NOT a competitive video game. Unfortunately, there is a ton of focus in this server, even from some admins, on being "good" at the game, so it sort of results in an arms race between antags and security, leading to absurd scenarios like security having to carry around a crowbar and floor tiles.

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I hate to admit this, but the reason I primarily play sec is because I've seen most of the nonsense antags attempt, I've grown good at countering most of it, and I feel obligated to do so.

Cuz ya...it is an arms race...and it sucks lol

[Jzoid]

Why are you upset that antags are using game mechanics such as maint and space lube to their advantage? At least they're putting more thought into it than going stealing a taser. Tasers are honestly worst, in a 1xY corridor, you're likely to get fucked by them.

Simplest solution? Don't be an idiot. After a while, space lubed tiles should start sticking out, if they don't just stop running after the guy once they pull out a squirt bottle or beaker.

Besides, it's not like only antags can use them. Being chased by a duel esworder? Space lube.

Wizard? Space Lube. Nuke Ops? Space Lube.

Sure, it may seem power-gamey, but there's not much you can do, a lot of the mechanics in the game are power-gamey, and hate to say it, but without them, it'd hardly be fun.

[ZN23X]

Honestly Birdtalon was probably somewhat right when I first posted this. Not that I had just died to it right before posting but I had recently experienced it alot. I've died to stupid crap so many times at this point I don't even care anymore. I've also gotten much better at dealing with the stupid crap. Bring it on

I'm willing to admit when I'm a bit salty. Pretty sure I'm fueled by salt ???

Edited March 23, 2017 by ZN23X

[Jzoid]

BTW, if you can't be assed to carry around crowbar+floor tiles, meth implants work.

[Sothangel]

Space Lube does have a few methods of countering (Removal of floor tiles and some random chemical I can't recall currently (Something like Drying agent? (Holyshitthreebrackets))) but in each of those "counters" you need to stop and do something; so whoever possesses it will have gotten away. That's fine, and can be handled - I suppose what frustrates people is the relatively long stun (Which is enough to get you killed) or the common use of mixing it with a certain chemical that sets you on fire; the glorious combo informally referred to as "memechems".

The combination of excellent area-denial, extremely easy access, persistence of the lube on the floor and sheer amount of the shit you can carry in one bottle add up to frustration, I would wager.

[Anticept]

I wouldn't mind space lube having a shorter lifespan. Lately, shitters have been abusing space lube smoke grenade spam in the main halls.

That said, it's a tool that I don't think that it, by itself, is the problem. Antags could just fill a spray bottle with water and still have the slipping problem, or drop the soap. It's just the crazy long lifespan of spacelube...

Edited March 23, 2017 by Anticept

[Shadeykins]

A shorter lifespan is perhaps a reasonable nerf, albeit not a terribly needed one.

 

Lube is hazardous, and about 50% of memechemmers die to their own lube sprays.